Ya'lls opinions on high fence hunting or "whitetail preserves"

So I worded it poorly, still you get the point. In a fence you are guaranteed to see something, using a guide nothing is guaranteed.

 

Fletch,

Although I have never hunted whitetail behind high fence, I have hunted elk (I use the word "hunted" with vigor). I was sent to killed six trophy class bulls, the fence was coming down and the elk had to be destroyed to do so. Five skilled hunters spent four days and never saw the antlered beasts. The land mass was around 1200 acres. Funny thing, we did see six cows, three calves, and four spike bulls. The latter 13 elk were not registered with the property. Somehow they gained entry from the wild (got in but couldn't get out). We were ordered to destroy them as well to keep from contaminating Colorado's wild population. The larger trophy bulls were never located even after a helicopter with sharp shooter was hired to fly the entire property.

Bottomline, each one of us knows when it's hard and when it's easy. That personal assessment, however, cannot and should not be made until after day's end. If folks want to play this speculative game, then by all means they can do so. I won't! I've killed whitetail (among other things) in free range areas which were 100 times easier to arrow than anything I've killed behind fence. I am not about to create mental hurdles such as bait, tree stands, guns, trail cameras, etc. I like hunting! If I find it challenging, I do it...even with a slingshot.

 

I can respect that opinion.

If "outside" elk got in, it could be that the bulls got out and you were "hunting" animals that were no longer there. You are skilled enough that one of you would have at least seen one of them if they were there. 1200 acres is not that much ground for 5 guys to cover. It certainly would not be a challenge from a helicopter if they were there, even in mountains. I understand that not all fenced hunts are easy. But, most of them drastically improve your odds of at least seeing the game you are after. To each his own and I have no problem with it. Like I said, I have done it and may do it again. But, its not the same to me.

 

Well I don't know why not, anything with a fence around it is obviously easy, don't they just lead them out on a leash.

 

Just got off the phone with Trevor Embry. He and I will be hunting pronghorn antelope this weekend. He reports several dry waterholes in the parched Wyoming landscape (side note: What a lucky bastich, I picked him up at DIA this morning ending his Alaskan caribou hunt. He's in Wyoming tonight chasing speed goats). Three stock tanks are the only source of water within a large area. I'm thinking I'll hunt near one of those waterholes to guarantee proximity to the game I'm after. Fence or waterhole guys? Hard or easy? I'll let you know...



Don't tell Dubbs he's not really hunting!

 

Love the wit. Really do. Your point is well made and noted. Quiet honestly, I killed a slammer goat off a waterhole a couple of years ago and it will likely be the last. Kind of seemed like cheating. I think the ultimate challenge would be to spot and stalk or to decoy them. BUT, I am not saying I will never do it again! Best of luck to you. I hope you kill a nice pronghorn and enjoy your hunt. Who am I to put a definition on what hunting is. We all win as long as we get out and enjoy the outdoors. Safe travels fellow bowhunter.

 

Actually alot of them offer your money back or a free hunt if you dont.

 

What's that old saying? There are only two guarantees in life, taxes and death.

At some point, we all must come to grips with the idea whereas men have been hedging hunts since the beginning of time. Why should we be any different? A fence, a cliff, a gun, a bow, a waterhole, a tree stand, a pit fall, a trap, a bait station, a box canyon, an island...they are all tools used to procure and dispatch animals...wanted or unwanted. When they do their job, the hunt was easy. When they do not work, the hunt was hard. For me, this concept is pretty simple. Moreover and since for the most part our wildlife population is increasing, rather than decreasing, our fencing methods seem to be working well. I'd say, let this dog lie.

As far as animals being placed/reared to be harvested, well, most state DNRs sell licenses for what purpose? photography? Is this not farming...okay if the states do it, bad if the individual does it? Is fishing in a pond verses fishing in a lake still fishing? Both are hedged, right? Where exactly is the guarantee?

Thanks for the well wishes Fletch. I look forward to the first hunt of this fall's season. Goats are indeed difficult to hunt with a bow via spot and stalk. A bone on bone knee injury from 35 years of competitive soccer will prevent me from hunting this method this year, and prehaps years to coming. A replacement is in my future. I do love antelope jerky, so I'm hunting alternatively.

 

Best of luck to you Will and Trevor!! By the way Will, I was able to get a bear license. Been a while since we last chatted on the phone.

 

Will doesn't know it, but after a few seasons im going to take him up on his offer. Just if I lose, I may be too pissed to pay for his plane right back.

 

A high fence is the only thing mentioned that would turn what you are doing into something other than hunting.

Can a deer run away from a tree stand? Yes. A bait pile? Yes. Go around a cliff, pit fall, trap? Yes.

Can a deer get out of a high fence, once it is trapped? No. The fence creates a fixed situation for manipulation. It's very simple to comprehend.

 

In my life experiences, I've seen quite the contrary. I'd have six bull elk if it were as absolute as you make it. I've witness fallow deer go over fence multiple times...even three 2000 pound bull eland (all three cleared an eight foot fence from a standing start)! I've seen feral goats go through wire like a hot knife goes through butter, and there isn't a fence in the world capable of holding back hogs. As far as animals not being able to run away, what sort of bow do you shoot? Is it some turbo rocket powered thing or something? I mean, if a person has an effective range of 45 yards. That roughly limits his ability to procure game to somewhere around an acre at any given time. If the game isn't within that limit. should he be shooting? On a forty acre parcel, he will have a one in forty chance of being successful (providing he's hunting one particular deer). If that parcel is saturated with heavy cover, there's a good chance he's going home empty handed. Now increase the forty to 800 acres. Do the math and speculate a little. How about 3000 acres? 55,000? If you are going to draw conclusions, then at least take consideration of all the variables (quantity of game, personal ability, method of hunting, location, etc.). Blanket generalizations rarely work.

With everything I've said, I can tell you I doubt I will ever hunt white-tailed deer behind high fence. Why? It's because my odds for success in the wild are better and it comes at a greatly reduced price. But hey, that's just my opinion...

Steve, Thanks amigo! I will call and catch up. This boy has been busy!

Albert, dude...BRING IT!

 

Why mention you wouldn't buy deer behind a fence?

Cattle get out of the fence sometimes and then we have to go round them up. It's not the norm, but this happens.

Animals trapped behind a fence will always be farming, not hunting.

The shooting doesn't matter, it is a question of the fence and what impact it has on a hunt.

I think the real question we need to ask ourselves is: What does a high fence benefit? Does it benefit conservation? Does it benefit the wildlife? What does it teach the youth? I think we all know the answers.

 

Can't even watch hunting shows any longer where the hunt occurs south of Missouri. Sorry, I hope they enjoy their hunting. Just appreciate how hard hunting is here in Southeast Minnesota and wouldn't have it any other way.

 

He can actually run the opposite way. There are many other acres to reside on. Its not hard to comprehend.

 

Is that really the question? Im pretty sure this whole time youve been trying to state that it is easier behind a high fence.

High fence benefits the business owner and also conservation and wildlife. Owners get the money, conserved through not being logged or land being used as a waste dump, and wildlife because they get to grow a bit older than many animals in the wild before being killed.

 

The land first and foremost. It keeps people where they need to be, no questions asked. Who does it benefit? That would be the landowner and anyone to which he provides trespass rights. The high fence provides, in many cases, a more safe and controlled environment in which to hunt. The landowner spends money on the fence as well as its maintenance. That money trickles down through the community. Guides are needed, and thus hired. their money trickles down through the economy. Butchers work year round, as do taxidermists. Restaurants and motels receive clients. These restaurants and motels hire employees to service their clientele . The employees pay taxes. The taxes repair roads and bridges. So, I guess we all benefit from high fence. If you're like me, you do not enjoy paying the benefits of the unemployeed.

Do a little research on addax, dama gazelle, scimitar-horned oryx, and the American bison, do get back to me. These species are just a few I know of which have benefitted from fence. As a matter of fact, these species are either re-established or are being reintroduced to their native range. Have you payed attention to the plight of the African rhino? Thank God for fence. Any rhino beyond it is being slaughtered! QDM is intense behind fence. Deer actually grow to an age of eight or older. Surplus males and non-bearing females are hunted to the benefit of the majority. The state DNRs do the same thing when they limit doe tags.

Yes, unless you would rather some species perish. I believe the American bison was down to some 800 animals on three ranches. Would you care to guess the population now? Without the fence they would have gone extinct.

See the rhino example above...

You tell me. I believe it teaches them a choice. It teaches them that America is a wonderful place with abundant opportunities. It teaches them about conservation/preservation...that they have a job waiting for them if they so choose to take it. It teaches them individualism, they do not have to listen to an ill-informed elitest with misinformation and a dissenting opinion. It teaches them to care...or not. It teaches them to be resourceful. It teaches them they can...or cannot. It teaches them friendship and comradery. They learn a special and undeniable bond that will never have anything to do with you, me, or anyone else. It teaches them success as well as failure. It teaches them to have an open mind. To camp, hunt, fish, run, play, scream with excitement...essentially everything a kid would do on the other side of your self imposed barrier, perhaps more safely.

I didn't.

Any more questions?

 

Getting ready to leave to hang stands and check cameras. I will educate you later tonight.

 

Quite immature still, are we = \