My son has a wolf tag and this is a hunt he has been looking forward to ever since he drew his tag. I think it is BS that some whiners can ***** and line the pockets of politicians and stop him from hunting. Like I said before I am not for eradication of wolves but not managing them is just wrong. If these bleeding heart losers would spend a fraction of the money they spend to help with habitat like us hunters do but instead there only concern is eliminating hunting.
I would like to see wolves managed like they do bears, below a certain line like hwy 23 it is a non quota area no drawing to get a license and their numbers kept low. I worked and still do work for the Minnesota DNR so I get the critical attitude, but thru my 16 years I have seen people promoted to management that could not manage a lemonaid stand in the private sector, sure there are some good people but like I said many of them would not stay employed in the real world.
I could see that for sure. Maybe even 3 zones. Low number lottery, high number lottery and OTC. Seems reasonable to me. After I finished getting the cabin ready this AM I ran out to check a few cams, guess what I got?
Yeah, that blows Tom. I remember talking to you about how excited he was. There'll be a hunt again. Less than 3 or 4 years I'd guess.
One thing you have to remember Fitz is that their average feeding range and territorial range is different. Wolves may travel up to 100-300 sq miles for feeding, but they aren't territorial for such great ranges. Studies I have seen is that wolves "defend" a territory of roughly 30 sq miles. So that could skew the numbers greatly. I agree that if 5 wolves travel 50 miles in a week feeding suddenly it appears that there are 50 wolves and everyone goes bonkers on the wolf population but I dont think the average pack controls 120 sq miles with no other packs in that area, especially in the deeps woods of the northern part of the state. Down south it could very well be over 120 sq miles since there aren't as many wolves down there. Just something to keep in mind. I think its impossible to give an accurate population
Cant speak for other states but here in WI. Populations are estimated off track survey counts. They have the Wolf area mapped in grids and people that are trained (Weekend Course) go out to assigned grids and count tracks they see. Now these people can be anyone mind you. Just how many tracks do you think a wolf lover would see and report? I had a wolf tag this year and the zone I was trapping in closed in 2.5 days and almost doubled the quota! In reality they would have had to announce the 24 hr. closure notice the same morning the season started to prevent going over the quota by such a large amount. It started on a Wednesday and I'm lucky that I work second shift and was able to make my sets. But many guys that had to wait till the weekend never got to try. Season was closed. They issued 1500 tags for the whole state. I know we have some good trappers in this state but you can't catch what is not there! There are far more wolves than the 800 or so that they say are in WI. Just a week ago I had fresh tracks in my driveway. I might be different and don't want them all gone just managed at a acceptable level where the risk of predation to pets and livestock is greatly minimized. I look at them as a renewable resource like deer and being able to match wits with them in hunting and trapping is a enjoyable experience.
How many deer, moose, and livestock do you think those 3584 wolves kill ever year? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I guess I can't really say for sure on deer and moose. But in 2010 it would seem that 7 cows, 80 calves, 15 sheep, 15 dogs, 1 horse and 24 domestic turkeys were verified to be killed by wolves. So 87 of an estimated 400,000 cows were killed by wolves. It was said that 1.7% of producers in wolf range had issues. I think I remember hearing that a wolf will eat 17-19 deer a year. And the moose issue is hard to argue. Wolves have always been where moose are. And they've existed in similar densities in those areas. The population growth is mostly due to range expansion.
I think we should all remember that wolves aren't the only animal that cause problems for farmers and other people. Deer do considerably more damage to farmers pocket books than wolves. I don't know if pound per pound deer do more damage but overall deer cost farmers a lot of money. Coyotes are also known for killing dogs and probably small farm animals if they can. Everyone knows foxes kill chickens.... I just think wolves should be managed like every other animal, there is no reason why they should be special.
I can't argue that those seem like manageable numbers for livestock but when farmers are pinching pennies even the loss of one animal can sting. But if an area such as norther Wisconsin and the MI'S UP ( can't speak to your area of N. Mn) has a moderate wolf pop of even 100 wolves each that is 1,700-1,900 deer a year. These areas have had to contend with overly harsh winters and low deer reproduction because of it. Yes these areas are no stranger to tuff winters and deer have succeeded there forever but now they have a wolf population to further contend with. I don't know how these area's deer population have a chance. I think it is great that there are wolves around but I also think that the population should be managed by sound science not political activism. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I agree. Again, I'm by no means agree with them being put back on the list. I, however, disagree just as much with the average hunter's "kill them all" mentality. They are equally ridiculous in my mind.
I agree with you Fitz, the DNR here in Wi deffinatly needs to start letting tags go more often for bear. It s taking me 6 years to get points and I still need 3-4 more to get in the zone I want to hunt. Like I said before its going to be appeal time. Beefie
Fitz please do not take this as being argumentative. I like and respect you a great deal but I disagree with your info on packs vs square miles. In 2012 I filmed 7 wolves on my food plot that same night a friend 3 miles northwest of me saw and filmed 8 in his plot. He had a friend 3 miles north of him that saw four on the same night. We did not see the same wolves. All within 20 min of each other. The wildlife biologist for our area claimed I/ we must have seen coyotes as there were not 19 wolves in our entire county. I took my video and my friends to him. They were wolves. " his data must have been bad" was the response I got. My point is that when food is plentiful they seem to tolerate each other. Another myth is wolves and coyotes are never in the same area. This morning cut wolf and coyote tracks while running my lab pup. I have often checked my Coverts and had wolves and coyotes within an hour of each other. I like Fitz do not want them exterminated but I want their population controlled through legal hunting and trapping.
I don't doubt for a second that you and your buddies saw that many different wolves. Keep in mind, most of the time when talking about wolves I'm referring to an established population. As wolves move into a new territory, there's going to be an extensive adjustment period as they and their game acclimate to their new roles. It's also not the case that wolves are restricted to what their typical territory is. They'll slip into each other's territories and see whats going on. How the game looks, how healthy the home pack is, etc. Packs are also always changing. One yearling female meets the right dude and they pair up and form a new pack. Now they have to wander around to find a spot they can fit in. That process doesn't happen overnight. Might take years. Take a look at Yellowstone. 20 wolves introduced into a wolf's wet dream quickly grew to over 170. Now their populations have stabilized to a much more balanced number between 90 & 100. The park is an extreme situation for sure, but this illustrates what I'm getting at.
This is a start. I told many people when the wolves got put back on the list there would be a fight and that Wisconsin would be the initiator. I hit the nail on the head. I hope it works. http://www.fox21online.com/news/article/bill-would-remove-federal-protections-wolves-4-states
I don't understand why Wisconsin feels the need to bring them back. The northern part of the state has been cleaned out of deer because of them. They now shut the hunt down but I don't think that will stop the guys who run bear. They take way more than the wolf hunt ever allowed.
Wolves are not the only reason the deer population is down in Northern Wisconsin. Bad winters, bears, bobcats and wolves play a factor, but no species kills more deer than humans in N Wisconsin.
