I was thinking the same thing. He obtained permission and killed the bear within the law. Doesn't sound like much of a hunt to me, but he also didn't poach the bear. I don't see the big deal in this case.
Assuming he took it legally, I don't see it as an issue, if I knew it was someones pets I'd problaby lay off. If I heard about a record book buck in an area where I was aloud to hunt I would sure go after it, I'm not gonna ask if some old lady has been feeding him apples and corn.
I think, perhaps, a better comparison would be to jimmy houston. He didn't do anything illegal either, as I recall.
Jimmy did, he baited which is a no no in Indiana. I thought the bear was a "penned" bear when i first read this thread. Maybe it's time to take a step back and look at hunting and hunters. We all want to be succesful, but price to be succesful at a certain level is getting pretty high.
My understanding was jimmy houston did a high fence hunt, not baiting. Is that illegal? Maybe it's time we step back and reassess "trophy" hunting. That's what drives all of this type of madness. Get the "notoriety" of killing trophys. You think Lee and Tiffany would have a show if they shot animals for the meat and not the antlers? what are deer contests about? Antlers. I have read where guys shoot deer they would not have normally shot just to get an entry into a contest on a forum . You know, just to help their team out .
I can see both sides of this argument. I think people that feed bears are doing a great dis-service to both the bear & themselves. And since the hunter seemed to really bend over backwards to maintain legality, good for him, even though my meaningless opinion doesn’t think that what he did was much of a “hunt”. Now to comment on the general populace of hunters being low lifes, I am in 100% agreement. I’ve said this dozens of times before that poaching in PA is socially acceptable. The desire to kill something (even what might not be considered a “trophy”) over rides peoples normal everyday values. I’ve known people casually thru work, that were nice friendly people. Come to find out they didn’t obey a game law out there. Low lifes in one context, nice friendly people in another. I’ve yet to figure out why hunting attracts people who are scum bags, and at the same time can make nice normal people exhibit acts of scum bag behavior as well? We wont even get into treestand/camera thefts, and all sorts of other illegal/unethical behaviors exhibited out there. So while I think a lot is “trophy” driven, there is still plenty enough illegal behavior not directed at trophies that will turn your stomach.
What's wrong with the guy who was ILLEGALLY feeding the bear. Apparently this gentlemen was fined on numerous occasions for feeding the bear. How about all of the attacks and home invasions that result from people "feeding friendly bears" ? It's a sad story, no doubt. The bear was obviously comfortable in the company of humans, at least in one area. However, it's said that the hunter had NO idea the bear was "tame", no idea the bear was fed by humans. He legally hunted and legally harvested this animal. There is NOTHING wrong with the hunter. If I were him, yes, I would be upset about the situation, however, I would take comfort in knowing that I legally hunted the animal. I live in NJ. We have the most dense population of black bear, as well as the largest average (body weight) black bear, roaming our country side and mountains. The debate over bear in neighborhoods will never end. Antis claim they are tame and "only eat berries", while hunters and bear hunt advocates know better. We have both ends of the spectrum; bear that fear humans and bear that couldn't care less about us. Our "walkers"(bear that are so big they can barely run and cannot climb a tree) are monsters. 800, 900+ lb bear. That bear is going to do whatever he wants. he may tolerate a human if he is being fed, but, he is still an animal and willl swipe you in a matter of a second, if he so desires. I can understand your take on this matter, but, the title implies, suggests or is associated with story of a poached animal, this animal was legally harvested.
Bruce, I think they used a tape of Jimmy shooting a deer that was drugged and in a small enclosure, I've heard 6, 17, and 40 acres, irregardless, what Jimmy did wasn't actually against a law, it was whomever drugged the deer and put it in the pen (Russ Bellar) that broke the law. But it helped make a law in the state of Indiana.... No More High Fence/Canned Hunting is supposed to be allowed. The second part of your post I agree with. I've not shot a buck in several years because the RIGHT buck hasn't come along, but I've shot quite a few does to fill my freezer. The only notoriety I'll likely get is a nice mount for the wall, and more meat in my freezer, and that's fine with me, as I'm not really much worried about anything else. I've likewise participated in the contests, but I haven't killed a buck for any of them, because I'm only going to kill a nice one, and by my standards none of those that have presented me an opportunity over the last few years have quite met my wants. An e-mail I recently got, seems quite fitting at this juncture.....
Having never bear hunted I can't say too much on here. but if i knew that there was this tame monster bear living in a neighborhood- i think i might hunt it just for the people's safety.
I completely agree with you, Ryan. I think MI and PA are pretty similar as far as deer hunting, its traditions, the amount of hunters, and the type of hunters. The percentage of people who follow game laws in MI gets lower as you head north. I knew people when I spent a lot of time "up there" in my younger years. Very nice people, good people in everyday life, but they would "bend" the rules when it came to game laws. It was socially acceptable in that area, and that is the main problem.
I wasn't going to post because I didn't feeling like spending the time and effort to reiterate what I've said many times in the past, but Rybo said it all for me. You rock Rybo.
Ha Haaaaaa!! soon as I seen that Bear I thought about the Republican Party and the last 2 years that it did nothing, ( don't forget them digging us into a depression befor that) except sit around with their thumbs stuck up their sorry asses and draw a pay check, well they cried alot too! But I am tickeld they took the House back, most of them ran on cutting the deficit and now every one of them is refusing an appointment on the Appropriations Committee. All Mouth, NO ASS, Go figure! Corporate sponsored Tea Baggers are no different, Just another Terd with a paint job. Now back to the story. As far as the tame Bear goes, the old man was wrong for feeding the Bear, but so was everyone else in town, it should have been trapped and sent off. Anyone that shoots something on its way to get Hugs and Twinkes is Fricken Pathetic. The picture of him standing with his foot on the bear and his crossbow on his hip has Dumb F*** written all over it! Ask yourselves this. Did the headlines, "hunters kill tame bear", do more harm than good in the eyes of the public?
I'll assume this "Iron Worker" is a UNION occupation??? Amazing the number of people who've basically let the Union shape their views, and then when they get "EDUCATED" regarding the warped things they've been fed, they realize how ignorant they'd been, including my own father and uncle. Now if you're gonna go there, don't forget your LEFTIES Barney Frank, John Conyers, Maxine Waters, Nancy Pelosi, and good old Charlie Rangel....... Note back in 2005 they testified that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were in good condtion, stood in front of those charging that they may have had dangerous high debt, and it took until 2008 for it to all BLOW UP!!! And we can go all the way back to Bill Clinton for how we got to that point when the "Fair Housing" stuff was pushed through, and it basically mandated that even if someone had a ridiculous debt to income ratio, they were still mandated for a loan, if you've gotten a loan over the past 10 or so years, you had to pay a fee for Fannie or Freddie to be an overseeing approver of that loan, NOT the bank. They basically FORCED many of our banks to approve loans that should've never been approved. What happened??? Well, I think we know that story now, but we don't have to go there do we??? Ironically, the LEFTIES overwhelmingly won the areas that geographically had the HIGHEST # of foreclosures. Ok, now let's go back to the real issue, and leave the politics out of this. Had this bear not been overfed and in a poor situation for a wild animal to be in, then he'd have never likely been this large, or this unafraidl of humans. Those who are most outraged are actually those who are likely responsible for the result.
I'm not understanding your anger, Sliv. How does the current economical state of our union affect you, personally? Be specific.
Actually I was hounded one year to go out and shoot a doe just for the fifty points in a contest. NOTE: it wasn't on this forum. I thought about it and decided it wasn't what hunting was about for me. I don't watch hardly any hunting shows on tv anymore because of all the chest pounding and overly excited morons sayin "that's what I'm talkin bout". I don't like the whole mess about this bear story It was killed legally,but I don't agree with the circumstances around it. I feel the guy took advantage of an "Easy target" just like a guy who felt it necessary to kill a 40-60 lb bear here in the NW corner of Pa. What kind of challenge is that? I don't hunt bear because I won't eat them. I understand they need to be controlled as with many wild game, but If I don't or won't eat it I'm not killing it.
I take my bow, walk into the woods, and hunt. That is how complicated I get in the hunting woods. For me, I do not care to pursue such an animal as Bozo the neighborhood black bear. The people feeding the bear are half the problem in the above situation.
People have lost ethics!!!! I have always taught my sons to be sportsmen. Ethical, honest sportsmen. It's not about outwitting your quarry on his terms anymore. It's about killing. It's about self boasting. "Look at me, I'm a great hunter". The man who hunts his ass off and takes his quarry because he outsmarted him, that is a hunter. I have let several bucks walk with my bow. It's not about killing. I don't care how big the critter is, I would never forgive myself for taking an animal that everyone has come to know around the neighborhood. I have to say that every hunter has his own idea of right and wrong. Mine's just different than his. It's a decision each and every hunter has to deal with on his own. If it doesn't feel right, don't do it. If you have to ask, you already know the answer. Teach your children ethics and carry it on!!!!
It's probably time to take the political conversation out of this thread. On here I'm sure you'll find Lefties and Righties, both with passionate feelings as to why they are either. That does nothing but brew anger and frustration. This is a hunting forum, not a politcal one. How about we keep it that way for civility's sake. About the bear. I think what this guy did was a favor to the public. While "hunting" may not be the appropriate term (depending on the man's, who shot the bear, knowledge), he definitely did this community a public service by removing a "tame" bear from the area. Let's think about Roy from Siegfried and Roy... that was a "tame" tiger, was it not?
