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Vegas, baby.

Discussion in 'The Water Cooler' started by dnoodles, Oct 2, 2017.

  1. Skywalker

    Skywalker Grizzled Veteran

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    Except assault rifles are not available to the public and have not been available for a very long time. Please don't fall into the media and politicians trap and use their terminology as incorrectly as they do.
     
  2. cls74

    cls74 Legendary Woodsman

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    And reversing that sentiment. Would you want to defend your family with a bolt action or semi automatic.

    Guns are made to defend as much as they are to kill. The argument can go both ways
     
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  3. Skywalker

    Skywalker Grizzled Veteran

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    One thing that is unique about our country is the fact that we can legally own firearms of basically any design, with only few exception. That right gives the people a lot of power. Power against foreign invaders, but even more so, power against an oppressive government. As long as the people are armed, we need not fear the government. There are many, many countries in the world that do not have that ability. Some are being oppressed, and some are not, but the opportunity for an oppressive regime to take over is always there. Our guns and the right to own those guns will guarantee we never have to worry about that.
     
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  4. remmett70

    remmett70 Die Hard Bowhunter

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    You give me a bolt action rifle with 20 rounds to shoot, and you take a full automatic with 20 rounds. I guarantee that I get more hits than you. Being deadly is not a matter of how fast you can shoot, it how accurately you can. On the same note, go shoot two weapons either semi or fully auto, one in .223 and another in .308. I guarantee you would be more deadly with the .223, even though they both can shoot the same speed.

    assault weapons are nothing but semi-automatic weapons.
     
  5. MnHunterr

    MnHunterr Legendary Woodsman

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    It's also our right to kneel during the national anthem. Can't have an oppressive government telling them to stop kneeling, it's their right.

    This argument will never be solved. Period. It will continue to go round and round.
     
  6. fletch920

    fletch920 Grizzled Veteran

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    In a crowd of people where speed counts, I guaranteed that the fully auto will get more kills before the shooter is eliminated or the targets are gone. You cant argue that a semi-auto or fully auto is not more effective at mass killings. If you do, you are in denial.
     
  7. fletch920

    fletch920 Grizzled Veteran

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    As defined, assault rifles can be switched to fully automatic. Sadly, bump stocks and/or very slight modifications to a semi-auto AR style weapons makes them the same or very similar to fully automatic. remmett can get more kills with a bolt action, so why do we need the high capacity semi's?? Sounds like we would be smart to give them up.
     
  8. MnHunterr

    MnHunterr Legendary Woodsman

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    This is one change we could make. Make it harder to get bump stocks and... What are they like $50 and relatively easy to get (I have no knowledge of bump stocks so I have no idea, just basing off what I've recently read).
     
  9. fletch920

    fletch920 Grizzled Veteran

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    A pump shotgun with buckshot is my choice for home defense. They don't fail or jam. But, I also don't believe that the government is going to come into my town with tanks and force me into labor camps if I don't own assault style weaponry. The sky wont fall.
     
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  10. remmett70

    remmett70 Die Hard Bowhunter

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    In a crowd give me a shotgun. If you watch all the videos of the Vegas shooting, he started out shooting rapidly, but as it went on, went to more controlled shooting. We will never know which form was more effective. Quite often in shooting situations fully automatic is used more to scare people to get them into positions where they are not moving and then shot. But then as I stated, what is most important is being able to keep the barrel on target and the biggest reason "assault weapons" are effective is because of the rounds they are shooting.
     
  11. Marauder

    Marauder Die Hard Bowhunter

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    So after reading 4 pages of posts I've learned this:

    Guns aren't the problem. People and mental illness are the problem.
    Evil people do evil things. We can't make and enforce laws to stop evil.

    What can we do? Are events like this going to continue? Are they going to get worse? Should we arm ourselves and prepare for the worst and hope for the best?
     
  12. remmett70

    remmett70 Die Hard Bowhunter

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    In Vegas, I have no doubt that had he simply used a bolt action rifle or shot single rounds instead of bursts, he would have been able to kill just as many if not more. The reason he was caught was because the smoke from the multiple rounds set of the smoke alarm. Had he just been shooting single shots, it would have taken much longer to figure out where he was and respond. He could have sat in that room just picking people off at will.
     
  13. MnHunterr

    MnHunterr Legendary Woodsman

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    The answers you will likely receive.

    What can we do? Nothing. Evil people are evil people.
    Are events like this going to continue? Yes.
    Are they going to get worse? Yes.
    Should we arm ourselves and prepare for the worst and hope for the best? Yes.
     
  14. Germ

    Germ Legendary Woodsman

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    Yep, we are going to do what we are best at, nothing.
     
  15. cls74

    cls74 Legendary Woodsman

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    I don't think there is a solution. This country and world is so full of hatred it is reaching a boiling point that is not going to end well for anyone.

    Take all guns away and mass killings will still happen. The reason these are becoming more successful isn't because of the weapon, it's more in lines with the time and thought put into carrying out the attacks.

    Someone just snapping is usually limited in numbers due to instantaneous impulse and no forethought
     
  16. remmett70

    remmett70 Die Hard Bowhunter

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    Will they end, no. Why because we will never know when, where or how the next incident is going to happen. It is really no different than dealing with computer and hackers and viruses, we are always reacting to what was done last.

    Boston was pressure cookers. Manchester was suicide bomber, This was a shooter. had somebody planted an explosive this could have been just as bad or worse without the use of a gun.
     
  17. fletch920

    fletch920 Grizzled Veteran

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    And again, I will argue that the design of the weapon which allows for large numbers of rounds to be delivered in a fast and efficient manner makes it a killing tool. That's why it was designed for military use. The delivery of the round is what makes the weapon most deadly. You and I have no need for weapons that have that kind of potential.
     
  18. remmett70

    remmett70 Die Hard Bowhunter

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    They are semi-automatic weapons, that is it. They can be shot faster more accurately because of the rounds they are using. As I stated and you apparently ignored. Take two semi-automatic weapons, one in a .223 and another in a .308 and I guarantee you will be more deadly with the .223.

    Semi-automatic weapons exist in Pistol, rifle and shotgun form.
     
  19. Marauder

    Marauder Die Hard Bowhunter

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    Pretty scary out there. I suppose we could just try to stay safe and hope we don't get caught in the crossfire.
     
  20. MUDSHARK

    MUDSHARK Grizzled Veteran

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    It's not the firearm, it is the PERSON holding the trigger or pressing the trigger

    God bless those who put their lives in danger everyday and those who placed Thier life in danger who helped at the concert for whatever reason
     
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