After all the threads on papertuning I decided to revisit it with my Bogan longbow shooting a 3 fletch 5" helical feather off the shelf with a Grizz Stik Sitka. This reaffirms why I don't bother papertuning anymore: The best tears were right where I had it set from bare shaft tuning (1/8" high of level). Everything got a worse nock high tear from 3/8" high to 1/4" low but the nock high tear would never go away; likely from the feathers contacting the riser, which is unavoidable.
When I paper tuned my arrows Rob the holes looked like 22 holes. My arrow flight Is absolutely Incredible. I always thought I had a great arrow set up before with my 2216's. It was good but let me tell you the set up I have now Is great!! I won't loose hardly any energy with my arrows In flight, they are perfect. My paper tares Impressed me.
How close were you Rob? Honestly I haven't done much with paper tuning so I can't say a whole lot but the small holes I was getting have to tell me something don't they?
Maybe I'll play with some of my other shafts but from bare shaft tuning these were grouping bare and fletched shafts together to 20 yards and right on where I was pointing the bow. They always did have a little porpoise that I don't like though. (as is evident) I was papertuning at 5 feet.
Here's my take on this.... 1. My bare shafts and fletched arrows were hitting the same POI, too. Disclaimer......this was with FP's. 2. When I screwed on a large, fixed head.....my arrows were hitting the same (windage), but low (elevation). Made me tear my grey hair out. 3. I paper tuned with fletched arrows.....and got a spine-weak/high nocking point reading. Again....same POI when shooting bare shafts and fletched. 4. Dropped the nocking point down (VERY little). Dropped my tip weight 30gr. 5. Perfect tears at 3yds. 6. Perfect tears at 6yds. 7. BH's group with FP's, after this. 8. Remaining grey hair - intact. 9. Confidence - high. 10. 5 deer down. I will NEVER go afield with BH's again, without going through this exercise. Your mileage may vary.
Tinkering with one thing at a time (arrow spine) here's what I came up with; WTF?! The more stiff the spine, the more nock high tear I get. The weakest spine gives the most classic "stiff spine reaction"... This is why I hate papertuning; nothing but headaches. Is it even possible to papertune a bow shot off the shelf? There's no way to eliminate riser contact.
It could be a number of things Rob. Tip weight, nock set, bad release here and there, who knows. All I know Is It worked for me and I shoot off of a shelf. I can feel your frustration.
Let me ask this, Rob..... What happens if you get close (bare shaft tuning) ....THEN switch to the paper tune? I eliminate BIG spine discrepancies via bare shaft tuning. A high tear can indicate a nocking point too high....AND a too-stiff spine reaction. It can also indicate a too-low nocking point. I wouldn't put too much stock in single arrow tears. You're looking for a pattern.
I'm thinking not on the release because it's consistant shot after shot. I'm thinking not on the tip weight because it's consistant when spine weight changes. I'm thinking there's something interesting with the nock set but why the difference between the 2018 and 2117/2216 in relation to nock set reaction when the nock set is consistant between all 3 shaft sizes? All I can come up with is a big ol' WTF? Don't I have enough grey hair already? I'm quickly moving from "distinguished" to just plain "old".
Rob , this is the reason i don't papertune , but seeing as i'm bored with redhair , i may try papertuning as an alternative hair colourant . Seriously though , i may just try it if only to make my bow more efficient .
Which shaft (of the same length) bare shaft tuned, best? What was your final reading (nock orientation) when you were satisfied the bare shaft was "correct"?
Personally, I don't paper tune, my arrows fly like darts so I don't feel the need. Rob, how are the nocks fitted to your string?? If they snap on to your string tightly you will get a false reading every other shot.
Joe: I'm not disputing what you're saying. I may learn something, here (likely). But....if they're all the same.....how would you get different readings?
If they are to tight or have to snap on the string, they aren't leaving the string properly, smooth if you will. If they snap on they have to snap of upon release. This drove me nuts when I first started bare shafting my arrows, I got the proper nocks/serving and problem solved! I can nock an arrow, point it towards the ground, tap my string, arrow falls off.
Unless his release is exactly the same every time, no string torque etc... he will get a different reading, it'll drive you nuts!
Hell....if his release isn't repeatable......there's no sense in paper tuning, at all (or bareshaft tuning).
Yep, to me it sounds like a release problem or a nock problem or even a combination of both! Thats the exact reason I don't paper tune, I'm not that good to get an exact release everytime! LOL! Bareshaft em', fletch em' and shoot em'!
