Things Looking Up in PA... Monster Bucks being taken

This is incorrect, you can take as many bucks as you have tags for in NY.

"Deer

The number of deer a hunter may take depends upon the licenses and privileges purchased. Here is a description of the tags received with each license type. Refer to the chart below for a description of how each tag can be used.

Resident Hunters:
If you purchase:

Small Game/Big Game, Sportsman, or Junior Hunting (age 14-15) --
You will receive a Regular Season Deer Tag.
Muzzleloading OR Bowhunting Privilege (orJunior Bowhunting)*--
You will receive a Bow/Mz Season Either Sex Deer Tag.
Muzzleloading AND Bowhunting Privilege (orJunior Bowhunting)*--
You will receive one Bow/Mz Season Either Sex Deer Tag and one Bow/Mz Season Antlerless Deer Tag, both of which may be used in either season.
Conservation Legacy or Super Sportsman License-- You will receive:
a Regular Season Deer Tag and
a Bow/Mz Season Either Sex Deer Tag and
a Bow/Mz Season Antlerless Deer Tag
Trapper Super Sportsman -- You will receive:
a Regular Season Deer Tag
a Bow/Mz Season Either Sex Deer Tag

* Residents must purchase a big game license to be eligible for Bowhunting and Muzzleloading Privileges." This was copied directly from DEC's website. http://www.dec.ny.gov/outdoor/8305.html

 

There are so many things that go into hunting license decrees that it can not be put on AR. One of the biggest reasons, kids are not getting into the sport...as that link you sent shows. Its not "cool" to hunt any more, and compared to everything else kids can do, its boring. That is fact, known all through the hunting world and a huge worry we all have...that our sport will get so weak that it will lose its future battles. Why do you think they push the "take a kid fishing" and "take a kid hunting" promotions so much? Why do they open special seasons for kids? Make it cheap for kids? Its not because they want kids to have fun (sure that might be part of it), but its because as a business point everyone knows we are losing the youth. You lose the youth, you lose the future of hunting. Back in the day hunting was the thing to do. Kids didnt need special seasons, discounts, or anything else to help push them out the door...they were begging to go hunting. Now, as hunters pass on, not near as many hunters are taking their place. Now I am sure a rather good size number of hunters left because of the ARs...you can not make everyone happy as I said before. But you can not put all of the loss on ARs...heck I dont think you can put half on them. If you are a hunter, and love to hunt, you are not just going to quit because you are no longer able to shoot a spike. Thats insane to even say. You are unhappy but still out there after them...upset, but still there. If a hunter just stopped, its for plenty of other reasons...not because they have to pass small bucks.

Now, you are right, having younger bucks only to breed doe makes for a rough deer heard. But again, that can not be ut on ARs. ARs are set up to allow deer to live longer, and its clear that has worked. That has been proven earlier in this thread. If you are forced to pass that spike, he will get older (assuming it doesnt get killed another way). You say hunters were managing their own bucks? Then the ARs should have been a blessing to them. Now they have government help, knowing that the hunters on the property or hill next to them also have to pass that small buck they just passed. Hunters can not be allowed to fully manage their own herds. Thats how so many species have been wiped out over the years. Deer are a perfect example. Deer numbers are better now then ever known...because government set rules, bag limits, and so on to make hunting better and the animals better. Elk in PA are another perfect example. ARs have helped the age of the avg harvested antlered deer go up, its proven. Hunters always used to shoot the first legal antlered deer they seen...now they just have to let them spikes and forks walk and get older, instead of dropping that deer and ending its chance of getting old and big.

 

Look, everyone at this point should be able to tell as with many other topics that we believe our side and will hold to that. I can day A, you will say Z, I can point to one fact you will point to another. It all comes down to what I keep saying, you can not please everyone. I'm not trying to change your thoughts or opinions. If you are upset about somethin and want to justify it by putting it on ARs I'm not going to try and change that at this point. I have learned my lesson there. Again this thread points other wise, with more supports then people against it. So do the studies shows in this thread. But, not everyone, as this thread and them studies, are going to be happy. Still shows a higher percent are happy then unhappy.

Either way I hope something happens to better your hunting area there. I hope things chamge for you and hope you can get back to being happy in the woods. I guess time will tell...

 

Sure, we can agree to disagree, but it's sad that ARs get support with false information. Biological facts don't support ARs. They used to sound logical until they were tried for decades and high-grading was the result of the post studies. I've explained that already and it was ignored. I don't mind disagreeing but I am providing data and again there was no response to the fact that the number of PA hunters are trending down year after year and the "data" showing more people are for ARs is clearly inaccurate because over 1/6 of hunting population no longer hunts since these ARs took affect. You also cannot argue the number of deer taken since the ARs were instituted, so either way, it's a lose/lose but you continue to support something with false data. If more people in this forum support the PA ARs, then it just goes to show that there are more gullible people who know so much that isn't so. I want a logical debate with someone who can refute my proof, not a concession that we can agree to disagree, that's just being ignorant to the truth and having an opinion without knowing why you have it.

 

Lol if you say so bud. Take care, and again I hope your area gets the magic change you hope for...

 

I don't mean harm, I just like good debate, and although we disagree, I feel as I am right (and I know you do too). But I don't want you to think I am attacking you or that I am unfriendly. I think we CAN conclude and both agree that we want what's best for the hunter - whether we agree what that is or not. Thanks, I hope our area improves too, we are trying to figure out how to do that and with less hunters there's less people pushing deer too. We haven't found a solution yet. I don't think we need magic, we just want it to go back to what it was before the ARs because we were getting bigger bucks and more deer harvested altogether. If it meant the rest of PA kept the AR, that'd be fine, I just want to manage our property how we want to.

 

I dont think any different of you my friend...I know its a touchy subject for some. Your side will never make sense to me, but I dont blame you for thinking it. They have worked amazing for my area and all the areas my close friends hunt (southwest pa, southeast pa, northeast pa, and south central pa)...so I will continue to support and hope they stay for my life time at least.

 

That is because you are talking areas with high deer numbers, some areas don't need HR any more, many never needed it at all, yet the AR supporters never want to hear it.
If you have deer to hunt AR is great , if HR killed most of your deer ARs suck its not that hard to see.

 

Northeast (where I hunt) and south central do not have a large herd...not by a long shot. And the mountains of southwest are the same way. HR sucks, not fighting anyone on that. It's needed in places but it wasn't done quite right I'm most in PA. But again, for the 20th time at least, this is about ARs.

 

My point being ARs would be supported over whelmingly if they had not been the excuse for the state wide unrestricted doe killing,WMU were introduced to cover the unlimited antlerless license sales the decimated deer numbers state wide instead of where numbers really needed reduced. The county wide unites were fine and would of allowed a better control of tag numbers, yet WMUs allowed huge increases in tag allocations while the herd was being reduced excessively.
ARs would work with out herd reductions at the levels we have experianced.

 

don't think many will argue that!

 

The PGC snookered the states sportsmen with the Ole divide and concur method of do what you want, all the while deigning what your original goal really is.

Its a shame, it could have worked wonderfully for us, yet once again the goverment got in the way of whats right.

 

Still 1 buck per season........you can use your reg season tag during late season but only after failing at its intended use. Can't use any buck tags early so not sure why you think that is "incorrect"

 

Buy a big game license and you get a regular season buck tag, then buy a bow/muzzeloader license and you get an either sex tag. That gives you the opportunity to take TWO bucks. There is NO NYS law stating only one buck can be taken per year. You can shoot two.

 

I never said there was.