The Illinois Whitetail Disaster - Don Higgins

I think the whole reason of Higgins article was to do exactly what it made us do. Talk about it. Get it out in the open. Make people realize that their are other factors besides EHD causes the numbers to decline.

 

I agree with most of what Higgins stated. Its also not rocket science.

I've read everything here from don't blame govt. for the extended seasons to blaming hunters for overkill to severe winters to EHD to coyotes. Its not one thing, its a mixture of many things. I've bowhunted here in Illinois since 1977(shot my first deer..a buck) that first year. For many years we were only allowed 1 archery permit per year and even residents were not guaranteed a firearm permit each season. The herd eventually grew into what it once was, and in my estimation at its peak perhaps 7-10 years ago.

Like I said, its not rocket science. End our deer hunting season on December 31st...as it used to be. Stop allowing bowhunters an unlimited supply of doe permits, issue a one buck limit per season...no matter what weapon is used. Restart mandatory check-in stations. These would be a start and adjustments can be made as needed yearly.

No, I have no degree in wildlife biology but after 37 years of hunting deer in Illinois I've seen the highs and lows, and most of the lows coincide with questionable decisions made during the last several years.

 

Legit!

 

Boom.

 

Interesting read, both the article and the responses it gathered here. Deer management is very intriguing to me, and it's amazing how many vast circumstances can affect a herd. Here's to hoping we can learn from our mistakes, all of them.

 

And I could come up with factual information that would rank another state as the top deer hunting state. Like states that don't allow rifles during deer season, limit the number of NR tags or have a firearm season that starts after the peak of the rut would probably put another state in the top spot.

 

I did not read every post so this may have already been pointed out, but there is only one group of people who want to see a large deer heard, and that is us hunters. Just about everyone else wants the heard as small as possible. We are outnumbered. But we have the control, for we are the ones killing the deer. If you feel there are not enough deer in certain areas, stop shooting them, especially the does. I have seen it first hand, in areas where does are over hunted, such as management hunts in parks, nature preserves, ect. the hunting soon suffers, big time.
IMO the CWD is a product of too many deer, and not to throw stones here, but it makes me think that you guys have been spoiled all these years, and are now simply being brought back to reality.

 

Higgins was clear. Politics and deer management do not mix! To anybody suggesting that hunters police themselves, you should realize: That option was long ago removed, with the founding of state commissions (DNR, Conservation Dept., etc..) who set seasons, limits, prices, ratios etc...If Illinois residents were to take it upon themselves to manage the herd, what good would it do, when out of state hunters who spend thousands to kill a deer, would more than likely be more concerned with filling their tag, than managing the herd for the state? Bottom line is, politicians do not make good deer managers!

 

The biggest thing I learned from the article was that PA evidently does not have the market cornered for hunters *****ing about the deer herd and blaming game commision and everyone else under the sun.

If hunters can complain in a state like Illinois, then in a state where the hunting actually is crappy you can only imagine the complaints.

 

Dan,
Let me start by stating the obvious - Todd Graf must be in desperate need of a moderator to let someone as ignorant as you be one. And for the record, I used the word "ignorant" purposely. You are totally ignorant regarding this issue. Have you ever herd the saying - "Its better to keep your mouth shut and be thought an idiot than to speak up and remove all doubt"? Of course from some of the posts made, I can see that your reputation was cemented long before you posted on this thread. Now go ahead and speak up and see how many more you can convince of your total ignorance on this issue.

To say that I have offered no solutions clearly is an idea proposed by someone who has absolutely no idea of my personal history and my involvement for the past 20+ years in trying to make the Illinois deer herd the best managed one on earth. I would be willing to bet that I have attended more meetings with IDNR and Illinois state legislators on this issue over the past 20 years than anyone who has ever visited this board. I did all of this at my expense including taking time off from a paying job. I have had multiple personal meetings with various DNR staff including many IDNR directors. In fact I have been invited to and attended multiple meetings with current IDNR director Marc Miller. Back in the day I testified in from of a group of state legislators that included then state senator barrack Obama; incidentally he sat 15 feet from me reading a newspaper during that meeting as the other legislators listened with at least some degree of interest. I'll tell you what Dan, I bet I have made more effort to enhance the Illinois deer herd for the benefit of ALL Illinois deer hunters in a single weeks than you have ever contributed to any conservation effort. Furthermore you have absolutely no idea what efforts I may be currently working on.

In regards to this article, take a look at the length of this article. It is already long enough and it covers a specific topic. I could write a book on this issue and my opinion as to the best solution. The question is, what media outlet is going to publish any writing that would take hours to read? I bet you learned a thing or two about the history of Illinois deer management didn't you Dan??? Of course giving someone credit for anything is a little tougher for some people than slamming them for something you know nothing about. Is your ego in such a fragile state Dan that you must tear down others to build yourself up? Guess what Dan, you have met your match here. I will put you in your place until the day that Todd boots me from this site. If you were just another anonymous poster I would simply ignore your garble, but you are a moderator and as such you are going to be help accountable, if by none else, then by me.

So Dan, IF you respond in any way I expect you to list your great efforts thus far in addressing this issue. Go ahead and show this board what kind of man you are with your childish rants but start by putting forth your efforts, after all, that is what you chose to hammer me about. I promise you Dan, I anxiously await your reply cause I am just getting started!

Note to Todd Graf - Todd, if you are so desperate for moderators on this website that you allow someone like Dan to do it, please let me know and I am sure I can help you find a more qualified and respectable person. From reading others posts it is clear that this is not an isolated incident. Thank you

 

Yes, Calhoun wrote a book titled "Prairie Whitetails". It is a collectors item today, and if you find one it probably wont be cheap.

 

Uh oh

 

Does this opinion have a real name? If you are going to be throwing false information like that out you better be ready to defend it, and I am not talking about on a message board. I have a pretty good idea who you are any way as your post reads like others you have made in the past on other boards. Maybe it is time you were forced to hire an attorney to "prove" your claims in a courtroom??

For the record, I shot a buck once that I was accused of crossing a property line to retrieve. I revealed every last detail of this issue in my first book. Apparently a false accusation by jealous hunter across the fence is enough to destroy someone in the eyes of other jealous people. Full disclosure of the details on the part of the accused not withstanding. If anyone wants to read the detailed story, it is chapter 10 in my book "Hunting Trophy Whitetails in the Real World" available here -
Higgins Outdoors Inc. - Higgins Tree Farm

 

glad to see you respond on our forums mr. Higgins.

while I don't believe it's necessary to attack Dan just because he disagrees with your tactic used throughout the quoted article.. I do welcome your opinion. (I disagree with your tactic of personal attack on miller as well).

as an Illinois resident I personally would like to see you write articles on this subject with less finger pointing. Perhaps more constructive ways that the states deer hunters can get involved in the process. What we can do in the field and how we can communicate our concerns to the politician.

I do believe your intentions when you wrote the article were good.. But finger pointing just forms lynch mobs and bruises egos.

If we are to get miller to listen to the states deer hunters.. Attacking him and his character of deer herd management is not the way to do it.

The bruised ego of another man is less likely to work with you in the future. Miller and the others you called out will likely write you off as just another hillbilly archer if they ever read this article.

You can sway a lot of attention towards Springfield mr. Higgins.. But it will go unnoticed as nothing but hot air with this approach.

You're better than that. You're a better writer than that.

 

Apparently your reading comprehension skills rival those of Dans friend making skills. Illinois was the very best whitetail herd on the planet at one time; significantly better than Iowa even. Just because you are a young pup and cant remember anything before the 1990s and cant comprehend what you read, doesn't change the facts. I never said Illinois is "top dawg" now.

Todd, this guy is a moderator too???? I sure hope you don't pay these guys because they probably drive away more visitors to your website than they attract.

 

i agree wholeheartedly with you rybo

 

wait.. Didn't you just say "at one time"

i rest my case.

and who said you said Illinois was top dawg?

this was a completely different conversation between two other guys. Looks like you need the comprehension skills. Maybe think before you write.

and as far as moderators are concerned.. I don't actually do any moderating. It's just a title that was never taken down.

 

Take it from someone who has tried to work with IDNR for over 20 years using every approach possible and as part of various sportsmens organizations and committees, IDNR is not going to listen to any of us no matter the approach. Opinions are fine but my opinion is based on 20+ year of experience. Anyone that thinks they can change things by working with IDNR and/or director Miller is sadly mistaken and poised to waste a lot of time and energy. Been there, done that!

 

No dukemichaels, you mentioned me by name in the post I quoted, did you not?

 

I can honestly say that I have never heard of this Don Higgins before and I have to say, I think he needs a hug.