Speaking of "looking good & playing good"... my new Destroyer

Well you always have the option of waiting until mine is complete, as I plan on doing it first. I'd even let you drool on it over a piece of chicken :-)

Dan

 

Yeah,......but the cable guard (any of them) is part of the problem (that wouldn't need a solution....if something wasn't driving its' existence). Like I said....I presume some designs are more harsh than others.....and maybe those are the ones needing this technology most.

It would seem that the further out of "in-line" your guard was....the more torque would be applied to the power stroke. Does that make sense? Compound that (no pun intended) with bows set up where the cams AREN'T in-line with the riser.....and it's no wonder torque is introduced to the shot.

Regardless....it's a good lookin' bow you have. Congrats.

 

Greg, I am really anxious to see how the Destroyer shoots and tunes in your hands. I really think that this is where the Destroyer will Shine and Win praises with the Masses.

I think the Speed will just be a bonus :-)

Dan

 

I've got a Limb Driver on mine. There isn't anough room for the button. I have the cord tied to the limb like I have on the last few bows...

 

I think Vapor Trail is also coming out with a new mounting attachment. Did you happen to see it Pat?

I will use it or a modified universal attachment like I have been. :-)

Dan

 

bad ass....

 

That bow looks sweeeeet

 

Belive it or not... The style of release comes into play here... A couple years ago when I was in R&D checking out the new stuff, they had a rope style release on the Hooter Shooter. The high speed (slow mo of course) was showing less than acceptable horizontal nock travel because the rope itself was pulling the string off center upon release. Obviously this could never have been seen with the naked eye because it happens so fast.

Then we changed over to a caliper style release (can't remember the brand or model) and it was MUCH better, nearly perfect.

With that being said... More often than not, horizontal nock travel is created by the style of release being used regardless of the bow make or model.


And what you're seeing in the video might very well be caused by the arrows paradox which is inevitable...

 

I didn't... Probably because I didn't look for it when I was at their booth... I don't mind tying it to the limb because its worked for me in the past...

 

Jeff,

Traditional cable guards will induce less torque. The cable slide has the ability to slide up the rod, as the bow loads through the shot cycle.

Roller guards do not move backwards like a cable slide as the limb tips move during the draw cycle. What this does is add additional load to the limbs, producing more speed. It's an easy way to add speed to a bow without compromising draw cycle. Since everyone wants a fast bow that draws butter smooth, this is a great way to pick up some of that speed without "feeling" it. Do a search on "Bowturbo" over on AT, this gizmo basically turns your regular cable guard into a fixed roller guard, and gives you that preload......and measurable amounts of extra speed. Same concept.

The only problem with the roller guard, is you get additional torque that increases through the draw cycle that transfers to the riser, and changes how the riser sits in your hand.......this translates into horizontal nock travel when the shot is executed. You can sometimes compensate for this by setting your rest up inside center, but that will typically show up when your less than perfectly consistent with your hand placement, post shot sequence, and/or when broadheads are on the arrow.

FLX gives you the additional speed of a roller guard, but also virtually eliminates the torque you typically get with the roller guard. Best of both worlds, and much more palatable for the typical hunter than a "shoot through" system with no cable guard of any sort. Ideally, a shoot through is really another fantastic option to fix this problem, but most guys don't have the form to shoot a shoot through (without hitting the bow arm), don't want to put a broadhead tipped arrow through split cables,etc.........not a real option for the masses, maybe the target shooter but not the "average" hunter.

Hope this clarifies a bit.....

 

Pat, that does work as well as what I do depending on the Bow you are setting up, and where on the Limb you are trying to hold the rest cord at. I know you know the closer you tie the cord to the axle the longer the launcher will stay up.

I ran into a Problem tying directly on the Limb on the 1st PSE BowMadness I setup. That's when I modified a universal limb attachment to make it work. I talked to Jarod about it and he said they were coming out with something similar, although I have Not seen one myself.

I'll just continue to use the modified universal until I do. :-)

Dan

 

Basically they had a plastic triangle with a hole in it and double sided tape to tie off the cord.

(As seen on Vaportrials website)



They also had some pads to place under the rest on the shelf. They also used this pad to tie off the cord around the limb.

I tied off my cord as you would tie your loop around the string. I'll have to take a pic. I kinda like it. ;-)

 

Interesting, Matt.

So the inherent design of the roller guard causes the extra torque......and then corrects for it?

Let me make an observation.....then ask an obvious (to me) question.....

In shooting traditional bows, the release of the string (off the fingers) and the (in most instances) cut-short-of-center side plates cause the archer's paradox. We mitigate/plan for this via tuning our arrows for it.

Is there anything inherently "superior" to an arrow not experiencing the paradox, IF you don't introduce torque, during the shot sequence? In other words, is it plausible to think the guy shooting the one going straight off the rest can repeat his release "better" than the guy shooting the arrow experiencing the paradox (more)?

Fair?

 

That's how I've tied my Limbdrivers off for the last five or six bows I've had too, Rob... with the exception that I do it EXACTLY like a d-loop in that I flare out the end of the d-loop material and melt it into a ball and then snug that up tight against the "d-loop" knot.

 

Rob, They are making a New attachment piece, and my guess they don't have any yet. I'm sure it will be similar to the way I modify the current one.

I talked to Jarod today but didn't think to ask him about it.

Dan

 

Mine is about 1/2 way between the limb fork and the axle.

 

That's how I did it first and the confidence just wasn't there and then I added the flair of the red. :D

Dan, I was wondering. They just must not have had it at the ATA show.

 

Matt:

Also....if you're experiencing the paradox, it stands to reason you're shooting a weaker dynamic reacting shaft.

Do you know if the two videos were shooting the same arrow? Or, if the bows are the same DW?

Just trying to put my arms around all this....as it IS interesting.

 

I use a clove hitch knot. The knot you're using looks like it could possibly slide up or down where the clove hitch pretty much locks it in...

 

They had some little square rubber doohicky that stuck on the limb face with little projecting rubber "fins" that came out of that which was supposed to keep your cord from sliding up or down, I guess.

I talked to the guy in the booth at the time (wasn't Jarod) and told him how I simply tied mine off with a d-loop knot but pulled the HECK out of and I'd never had one move on me and he agreed that was all you needed to do.

Heck, I tied mine like that around my Ross Carnivore 31 all the way around the solid limb and pulled it so hard that I actually thought I may have dented the Invelvet finish. Of course, I hadn't... but it never moved on me.