Need a little help

Discussion in 'Whitetail Deer Hunting' started by truebloodmorelia, Mar 4, 2020.

  1. truebloodmorelia

    truebloodmorelia Newb

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    So from what I have read/watched I have been led to believe that the best shot placement on a whitetail is right behind the front shoulder. I've tried to study as much anatomy as possible and I believe I am shooting in a "kill zone" spot. Trying to aim mostly for a double lung and hopeful heart shot. I think I am doing okay with where I am trying to place my arrows but a buddy who has an answer for everything who does hunt states I'm in for a long trailing. Can someone else chime in with some knowledge. He wants me to aim for scoring circles vs anatomy. What are your thoughts?

    The pics I shared are my placements and the area I have been aiming for. Should I continue what I am doing off anatomy or should I just practice hitting the 10 ring?

    Thanks
    Brandon[​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

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    [​IMG]
     
  2. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

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    Heart is best but as whitetail drop and move and we as hunters sometimes suck, double lung is a good idea as it's a bigger Target hence more forgiving when other variables change.
     
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  3. truebloodmorelia

    truebloodmorelia Newb

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    That I understand I have a mindset of aim small miss small and even if the deer drops aiming center allows the arrow to go a fair amount higher than wanted no? I would hate to spine a deer. I know we are human and wont hit perfect everytime I just think aiming lower allows a bit more forgiveness no? I could be way way off as I am green

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  4. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

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    If the deer stays still there is always you as the last variable. Miss one way while going for the heart and you hit shoulder (good chance you lose the deer) miss low at heart and you miss completely. Miss other direction and you might graze bottom of lung. If you know you are ON use worth going for. If you are not then double lung is safe and ethically sound kill shot.
     
  5. zeeinn

    zeeinn Newb

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    +1
    [​IMG]
     
  6. wl704

    wl704 Legendary Woodsman

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    A few other thoughts. The angle will alter where to aim. If you're in a treestand or the direction the animal is standing.

    Grant woods also has a good youtube vid on how deer often react based on whether their head is down (grazing... They drop) or up (generally can't drop as much). It's worth finding and watching. [​IMG]

    Ps an archery shot from A, is a real bad idea.
     
  7. Sota

    Sota Legendary Woodsman

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    B is not one I would take either, unless it was a really big buck at 50 yards. In all honesty I would not take B and probably not D
     
  8. dnoodles

    dnoodles Grizzled Veteran

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    looking at your shot on the 3D target-
    at ground level on that angle on a deer that doesn't duck; that's a dead deer on it's feet. Literally dead in less than 1 minute. Heart and lungs.
    Your friend is ignorant.

    HOWEVER-
    as others have noted; angles are everything in archery. From an elevated position; that's a risky point of aim. 1" low and it's likely a non-lethal hit. Deflect downward off a rib and it's likely a non-lethal hit.

    Something to consider- make your point of aim correlate to where you want the arrow to exit- on your target, where you are hitting is actually the perfect exit point. Any arrow shot from any angle that exits at that point is a dead deer. You could enter at the back hip and if you poke it out that pocket right above the elbow you have a dead deer. You shoot it head on in the throat and it exits at that point you have a dead deer. I'm not saying you should take those kind of shots, I am just saying whatever shot you take always think of where you want the arrow to exit. It should be right about that spot.
     
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  9. Sota

    Sota Legendary Woodsman

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    2 holes are key to recovering a deer you shoot with a bow. I have shot and found a few that had only 1 hole in them but generally you get a pass thru you will recover the deer.
     
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  10. dnoodles

    dnoodles Grizzled Veteran

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    you are thinking in the right direction. Almost always better to hit low than hit high.
    However; a spine is better than a gut shot. Deer drops and you can always finish it off with a well-placed follow up shot or 4.
     
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  11. truebloodmorelia

    truebloodmorelia Newb

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    Thanks guys.

    I'm hoping for full passes everytime but I think everyone does lol.

    I'll start to plan my shots to allow for angle and exit position vs entry. I'm also planning on shooting from diffrent heights soon enough to help simulate the shots I'd be taking when in the woods.

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  12. wl704

    wl704 Legendary Woodsman

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    When you do, there will be some additional learnings:

    Bend at the waist and don't drop the lead arm.

    Always wear a harness.

    There are more little branches than you thought you saw.
     
  13. truebloodmorelia

    truebloodmorelia Newb

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    I plan on shooting from a saddle so I'll be harnessed up the whole way. As far as bending thanks that a first I've heard that. Any other tips I would greatly appreciate.

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  14. Mod-it

    Mod-it Weekend Warrior

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    In fairness I will state up front that I rarely hunt whitetail with a bow (gotta feed my caplock black powder addiction as well) and that the elk I bow hunt every year are way less likely to move before the arrow arrives, but here is my humble and honest opinion.

    I'm very stoutly against aiming for a tight against the shoulder heart/lungs shot with a bow. Why? The front shoulder hit if I pull the shot a bit or the animal reacts to the shot and moves before the arrow arrives. Whack one animal in the front shoulder and you'll never hold that tight to it again. Yes it may still happen, and thus the reason many like a very heavy arrow, but why not give some more room for error? Your arrow in that 3d deer is barely off the back of the shoulder, clip that shoulder edge = not good. Center of lungs is the safest POA with the most leeway for errant accuracy, and I would also argue strongly that two collapsed hemorrhaging lungs is every bit as lethal as the heart also being included in the hit. I've seen several deer rifle-shot go 100-120 yards with the heart completely blown up (but not necessarily both lungs). Both lungs...along with the heart or without it...and they are down inside 100 yards a majority of the time. For example, I shot a cow elk quartering away, double lunged her but the arrow stopped in the far shoulder. She ran full out 80 yards and collapsed. Think about how long it would take an elk to cover 80 yards at a full on death run...she went down in a matter of seconds.
    Elevation aim point has many factors, i.e. ground level, in a tree, distance/time it has to move before impact, etc., but I personally like to get back off that shoulder at least a couple inches more than where your arrow is at.
     
  15. oldnotdead

    oldnotdead Grizzled Veteran

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    My practice is mainly from the tree. I ,even with bad knees, push it by Taking just 3 arrows and shooting each distance until dead on before moving target to next distance. I shoot instinctive so I don't measure distances. My mantra is breath, don't grip, bend. Then I shoot. BTW you can not mimic buck fever,but, climbing up and down that ladder to retrieve your arrows will get your breathing close to it in short time.
    Looking at your shot placement, I'd be a bit concerned about the "elbow". Believe me even a slug will go awry when hitting that joint. You may want the skeletal over lay. Have fun in the saddle.
     
  16. wl704

    wl704 Legendary Woodsman

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    Nope. [​IMG] [/QUOTE]
     
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  17. bucksnbears

    bucksnbears Grizzled Veteran

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    [/QUOTE]


    Yep. That one confused the chit outta me!
    The " shoulder is higher and perhaps a bit mor
    E foreward.
    The original 3- d target pic, 2-3" higher from about any angle other then a straight down shot will bring you home backstraps.
     
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  18. Sota

    Sota Legendary Woodsman

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    If you are ever worried about getting the right shot on a buck, let a borderline buck pass he will give you 20 perfect positions for a perfect shot in the 30 minutes he hangs around to taunt you for your arrogance.
     
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  19. dnoodles

    dnoodles Grizzled Veteran

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    upload_2020-3-5_21-9-18.png


    that deer is dead as F***.
    Even if the near side leg is back, all you gotta do is pop that front elbow/leg bone into the chest cavity and it's a dead deer within 100 yards. That's at least one lung and heart. Done it, seen it. My hunting partner killed a nice 8 point a few years back on a hard quartering away shot, the arrow hit the elbow, deflected up into the heart and the arrow fell right back out at the spot of the shot. Deer was snowplowing within 50 yards and the leaves were painted. The arrow penetrated less than 3" but put a about a 2" hole right in the bottom of the heart. Blood literally poured out like a faucet.

    Picture this image only with the near leg down. I put one right through that bone above the elbow, shattered that, heart, lungs, and buried into the offside leg bone (no exit.) Buck barely made it 80 yards.

    There's no more deadly ethical shot placement than heart/bottom of the lungs. Nowhere for the blood to go but down and out.
     
  20. Mod-it

    Mod-it Weekend Warrior

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    When I say shoulder I'm referring to any part of the front leg with arrow stopping bone. OND called it the elbow. "Chit" goes wrong in the woods.
    I'll continue to aim in the center of the lungs, where the most fudge factor lies for an animal that moves before impact or I pull the shot a bit.
    I have lost one animal, an elk that I hit in the shoulder.
    I still don't like that aim point. :bow:
     
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