Minnesota's Moose

Discussion in 'The Water Cooler' started by Fitz, Feb 6, 2016.

  1. Fitz

    Fitz Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Posts:
    19,215
    Likes Received:
    446
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ely, MN
    Here's a very interesting article covering what is currently happening with our moose here in Minnesota and the large study that is going on to find some answers.

    In saving Minnesota's moose, scientific breakthroughs and difficult choices - StarTribune.com

    Seven of the moose deaths have been within 7 miles of our home.

    On a side note, the sister study to this where they collared whitetails is coming to an end. They should be out this month to release and collect the collars. I'm excited to help out on last time.

    Here's some info on that study.

    https://www.bowhunting.com/blog/2014/07/18/trapping-whitetails-in-minnesota/
     
  2. Monster Raxx

    Monster Raxx Grizzled Veteran

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2011
    Posts:
    8,156
    Likes Received:
    1,762
    Dislikes Received:
    6
    Location:
    Buffalo Minnesota
    They are still trying to play a shell game with confusion over the affects wolves have on the moose numbers. They say that wolves have killed 33% of the collared adult moose but then try and say they might have been sick. They also quickly say that wolves KILLED 75% of collared calves before they shut the program down. Why did they shut the program down??? Because anyone with any intelligence and not having a specific agenda can see that if wolves kill 75% of the young moose then they are the main reason for the decline in moose numbers. I am not saying that we need to kill every wolf we see but the facts are pretty clear there needs to be a wolf hunt and keep their numbers in check.
     
  3. Fitz

    Fitz Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Posts:
    19,215
    Likes Received:
    446
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ely, MN
    It's my understanding that a good number of those killed calves had been abandoned by their mothers.

    Moose moms abandon research calves, threatening Minnesota study – Twin Cities

    Don't get me wrong, I've been 100% behind a wolf hunt from day 1. I put in for a tag every year it was open, but unfortunately never drew a tag.

    I think a combination of thinning both deer & wolf numbers would do a lot for the moose. The restorative cuts are nice too, but as I've seen with my own eyes, new cuts are brining in the whitetails in much higher densities than is typical up here. It's not going to help the moose if it raises their chance of getting brain worm. Those effected moose are like zombies. There's been a few near town here.

    Liberal tags and the new cuts near me might give me a chance to actually fill my freezer the next few years. One can hope.
     
  4. Sota

    Sota Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2014
    Posts:
    18,748
    Likes Received:
    8,139
    Dislikes Received:
    47
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Kinda funny in a way trying to restore the moose by clear cutting. Tree hugging dirt worshipers usually protest and try to prevent logging, but now it's logging for the moose and that is ok.
     
  5. Fitz

    Fitz Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Posts:
    19,215
    Likes Received:
    446
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ely, MN
    Of course there is a difference in how they clear cut for the moose than when a timber company does it.

    The "moose cuts" are done to mimic small forest fires. Mostly clearing along high ridge tops, leaving the large sentinel trees for reseeding, just like the ones that would survive a small fire. There's also lots of winding edges and pockets of cover as opposed to one vast wide open area. The brush piles are even piled and burned in the end. Afterwards, it's left to natural regrowth and not planted with a homogenous species of fast growing tree.
     
  6. Sota

    Sota Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2014
    Posts:
    18,748
    Likes Received:
    8,139
    Dislikes Received:
    47
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Fitz I have watched trained professionals try to mimic a small fire, I have also watched a let it burn approach backfire badly. Very difficult to burn hot enough to reach objectives yet not too hot because of the thin "soil" on top of the rock up there. Commercial loggers are not evil either they will leave marked trees, commercial logging could very well save the moose. Then again the only paper product in demand is toilet paper and disposable diapers.
     
  7. Fitz

    Fitz Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Posts:
    19,215
    Likes Received:
    446
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ely, MN
    They only burning they do is a brush pile after they cut. They are not actually burning the forrest.

    I also did not say commercial logging was evil. Just pointed out that they don't often lead to ideal habitat. especially if they replant.
     
  8. Sota

    Sota Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2014
    Posts:
    18,748
    Likes Received:
    8,139
    Dislikes Received:
    47
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Not sure if the moose habitat people are doing prescribed burns, but the forest service that owns the majority of the property in the NE corner of the state burns old logging units every summer. In areas that are very political for example the gunflint trail little burning and logging are happening however on the west side like Isabella to Ely there is much more logging and burning and there is a big difference in habitat and game populations.
     
  9. dnoodles

    dnoodles Grizzled Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2012
    Posts:
    6,041
    Likes Received:
    5,697
    Dislikes Received:
    9
    Location:
    People's Republic of IL
    I should've stopped reading that Star article the first time they referenced climate change. 37 references later they still couldn't stop themselves...
     
  10. Sota

    Sota Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2014
    Posts:
    18,748
    Likes Received:
    8,139
    Dislikes Received:
    47
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Very true with the climate change propaganda, same people that name storms.
     
  11. Fitz

    Fitz Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Posts:
    19,215
    Likes Received:
    446
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ely, MN
  12. Sota

    Sota Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2014
    Posts:
    18,748
    Likes Received:
    8,139
    Dislikes Received:
    47
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Fitz how do you feel about the deer numbers being lowered? Is it possible and how do you feel about the fact that your home field hunting is only going to decline?
     
  13. FLO

    FLO Newb

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2016
    Posts:
    32
    Likes Received:
    10
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    I read somewhere they want to reduce the numbers to 5 DPSM. That is crazy low.

    Kill no wolves but kill all the deer. Brilliant
     
  14. Fitz

    Fitz Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Posts:
    19,215
    Likes Received:
    446
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ely, MN
    I think that it's what should be done. But, as I said, in conjunction with a wolf harvest too. Take away all the deer and the wolves will be all the more hungry. I firmly believe deer numbers can be lowered with antlerless harvests. Just look at Northern WI. Limitless $2 bonus tags for years had a pretty big effect on populations where I hunt in Washburn Co.

    The cedar trees would like to see the deer numbers reduced as well. In my area there is no regeneration. The whitetails eat all the cedar before they can grow. Find an area where deer winter here and there are no young cedars. Go 10 miles into the BWCAW into areas that deer do not yard up, and you can find a much healthier cross section of cedar growth.

    We already have low densities, but they are still overpopulated for our environment.
     
  15. Fitz

    Fitz Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Posts:
    19,215
    Likes Received:
    446
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ely, MN
    Being in the insurance business, I figured you'd love the low deer densities :tu:

    Most of the area up here that they are looking at have been in the 1-7 DPSM range anyway.
     
  16. Sota

    Sota Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2014
    Posts:
    18,748
    Likes Received:
    8,139
    Dislikes Received:
    47
    Location:
    Minnesota
    Well the Feds control the wolves and the state controls the deer, moose and bear. There is that whole federal protection thing but that is another debate.
     
  17. uncljohn

    uncljohn Weekend Warrior

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2013
    Posts:
    937
    Likes Received:
    34
    Dislikes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Land of Pleasant Living
    Well they specifically noted that moose who don't co-mingle with deer but face wolf predation are fine in terms of herd health so its no shell game to consider the deer to be the main cause of what's happening. Wolves do also need to be properly managed, of course.
     
  18. Fitz

    Fitz Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Posts:
    19,215
    Likes Received:
    446
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ely, MN
    Save a :moose: shoot a :deer: :tu:
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2016
  19. bradn4201

    bradn4201 Die Hard Bowhunter

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2015
    Posts:
    1,844
    Likes Received:
    28
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ringgold, Georgia
    What's with this brain worm thing? Do all deer have this?
     
  20. Fitz

    Fitz Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2008
    Posts:
    19,215
    Likes Received:
    446
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Ely, MN
    No, not all deer, but it's fairly common. It also doesn't seem to harm whitetails, but the parasites burrow into a different part of the moose's brain and basically turn them into delusional zombie moose.
     

Share This Page