Find a happy medium. All the KE in the world wont help you if you shooting rainbow trajectories and you miss shots if you miss judge buy 3 yards. And on the other hand if yo shoot a ping pong ball so flat that you get no penetration...that wont do you any good ether.... So its easy find a happy medium
You guys make valid points for sure. One thing I am curious about now is, have any of you used lighter, faster arrows to compare with your heavy arrows. I have heard the same from both sides. My light arrows passed through perfectly after hitting part of the shoulder blade and the same from heavy arrow guys. My theory is it takes a certain amount weight to get the job done. What is that weight and why go over it? There is a balance of speed, momentum and KE somewhere and what is it? Is 350gr @ 305fps enough or is 500gr @ 230fps enough? Or is 200gr @ 200fps enough? How much momentum and or KE does it take to blow through an animal. I mean a .22 caliber bullet can easily pass through a deer and most are only 55gr. But they are traveling at what 1500fps or so?? I shot a deer with a 1oz slug @ 100yds and it did not pass through. Hitting only ribs straight in the boiler room. I know it was a bit far but, it was 437.5gr @ 1750fps. Now had I shot it in the same place with oh lets say with a .243, 95gr @ 3185fps, it would have passed through. I know, it is traveling almost 2 times as fast but, it is also less than 1/4 the weight. I know everyone talks about bullets are no comparison but, really they are. Yes they fly much, much faster but, there is still momentum involved. The same rules apply with momentum no matter what it is that is. This is how my brain works to compare the two. I have a theory and its what I believe it until I or someone else proves with evidence that is isn't. I am not saying I am right and you guys are wrong, just how it plays out in my head. What I would really like to do is get some of that gel stuff that is used for these types of test and do my own test using the same exact bow with different weight arrows. Use everything the same and only change arrow weight. Not arrow diameter or anything just weight. I would like to see that test done.
If you want pass throughs and great penetration increase your arrow weight. Try to find a happy medium if you don't want to sacrifice a ton of speed. I'm getting 70lbs of KE with a speed of 280 fps. I'm shooting a 400 grain arrow. With my set-up I'm not sacrificing speed or KE.
This is true but is a 350gr arrow really the weight of ping pong balls?? Nope. 350gr is pretty heavy if you think about it. What is that magic number?? Do any of us really know?? No. So how can I say Bruce or anyone esle is wrong? I can't and neither can anyone say I am wrong. They both have their advantages and disadvantages. its up to each one of us to figure out which we would prefer and which works better for us. As of now, I would prefer speed. I personally do not see any reason to dispute that as if now. My opinion may change as I gain experience but, there are others who have experience with both that agree with me.
If my calculators are correct, I should be getting 72lb @ 304fps @350gr. How happy have you been with the results??
To be honest I'd have to go home and measure them, but they're close to 28". On another note, my 7595's are the camo version which are 1.2 gpi heavier than the black version. Both are a .340 spine, though, so you'd be okay adding up to 100 grains behind a 125 grain broadhead. I know mine fly fantastic, quiet the bow on the shot and pack a real punch.
Like I said in one of my earlier posts...I saw a slight decrease in penetration going from my old bow that didn't shoot as fast as many of the bows we all use now, however I got consistant pass throughs with it. This year went to my Mission Venture with a 70# for the first time and penetration even into the targets wasn't as good as before...and the deer I shot this year go poor penetration....was a high-in hit, but didn't hit shoulder. That led me to discover I at the least needed to go up to a stiffer spine and experiment with a heavier weight...I'll let everyone know as my experiment plays out. I'll also be doing a fletch experiment between blazers, quickspins and artificial feathers I used to use...again will post findings.
Yeah I was curious if you had a camo wrap on them...I don't so yeah I'm fairly confident at minimum I'll start at 100grain insert and adjust if needed.
Why risk depending on weight of an arrow to punch through a shoulder? Lets say you hit the shoulder with a heavy arrow and it does not have enough momentum due to not traveling fast enough to pass through the bone. Then what happens? You have an injured animal that no longer has healthy use of its leg. No. Lets say you have the same shot on the same deer and hit the shoulder with a light arrow. If in fact that a 350gr arrow is not enough to pass through it, it would/should in theory, hit and at most piece the skin and maybe stick in the bone. This in turn should be just a short term injury and that animal will still have full use of the leg. Again, I am not arguing I am right, just that this is how I process this in my head.
Once you give it a try, shoot me a PM and let me know how it works out. One other thing. Once you bump that arrow weight up, try one other thing. Have someone with good hearing stand close and shoot a few shots with your stabilizer on and then a few with your stabilizer off. See if there's any appreciable difference in sound or vibration. I know that shooting my Drenalin with this arrow weight, there's no real difference in sound or vibration, so I took my stablizer off and haven't had it on the bow since July of last year. By all means, if you like it, keep it on there, but a hunting stabilizer is too short to really "stabilize" anything, and if it's not helping with sound or vibration, then it's just extra weight that I can do without.
You do not understand momentum and its relation to speed. A slower, heavier arrow will have more momentum than a faster, lighter arrow. Momentum facilitates penetration, bone or otherwise, not speed.
I will try the stabilizer trick...mine does have one of those harmonic stabilizers in it so I hope it does make a difference :D
It's like what would hurt more I paper airplane made out of notebook paper going 10 mph when hitting your head or one made out of tough manilla envelope paper at 8mph to the head. The manilla one is going to IMO, it's heavier, stiffer and with have a lot more energy to expel on to my head....no clue if this makes sense but popped into my head when I read your post.
Well its my point. Listen dude, you are new to bowhunting and very enthusiastic about it. Thats great, but there are times to sit back and listen. Not try and tell very experienced hunters they are incorrect. You can read all you want about bowhunting, but nothing beats experience. Nothing. My advice is to sit back a little and learn. Maybe back off from trying to answer every bowhunting related question after one season of bowhunting. Thats my point.
Without speed you don't have momentum Bruce. If a bowling ball isn't moving, it can't have momentum. Would you rather he hit with a bowling ball moving at 2mph or a golf ball moving at 20mph?? Although speed is not in the dirrect calculation for momentum, velocity is. Velocity is speed. momentum=mass*velocity. Isn't that the same as weight*speed??
