If you're a fan of Bowhunting.com on Facebook (facebook.com/bowhunting) you may have seen this image posted earlier this morning. Naturally it drew a lot of responses from the community - both good and bad. Some say it's great and you should shoot whatever you want - after all, you can't eat the antlers. Others say no, let the little ones live and practice QDMA at all times. One particular response really amused me. To which we responded And the final response, and ultimate reason for this thread. So my question is this - which is more selfish? Telling your neighbor he can't shoot a young buck because you want him to grow old and shoot him for yourself, or telling him to shoot whatever makes him happy? Should every hunter, regardless of outside factors including age, experience, time to hunt, ability to hunt, location to hunt, etc only be shooting 4+ year old bucks and letting the rest live? I'm interested to hear everyone's thoughts on this.
Hardcore QDMAers who try to push their views on everyone are selfish. But, it's like that with all things in society today, push your views on everyone else and force them to live the way you do. You could change the title of the thread to "Is imposing your views on others selfish?" And it would cover all issues in life.
I'm all for passing up the smaller bucks , whatever that is for a given area. As far a what I think others should shoot , whatever makes them happy. I do disagree with the guys that shoot the first yearling they see , year after year. They then question why there isn't many trophy quality bucks.
Justin, you already know the answer to your question. What could be more fair than your response? That guy is at least a quart low on brain cells. Sent from my Galaxy S3 and Tapatalk 2
I am out there for meat first. This is my third year bow hunting. I have gun hunted since I was 12, and have never "held out"for a bigger buck. It was just all about meat and spending time with my dad. Now since I have started bowhunting, my first 2 years I took small bucks of public land. This year, I have started leasing land and will pass on the smaller ones. I still will take does every year for meat, but if I am spending money for hunting land, I want to develop some trophies to bring off that land. It already has some great genetics, and not very much pressure over the years from other people. I passed on a 120-130 8 pointer opening day, I know I have bigger deer out there. The person I am leasing from has 120 acres across the street. If that same deer was to go over there and he shot him and was happy and used the meat. What right do I have to get upset about it. It goes back to shoot what makes you happy. The same thing would go to what ever someone considers a "shooter"buck. If you are tracking a shooter and trying to get him, but someone else ends up tagging him, are you going to go yell at that person for shooting your buck. But I will say, it was really hard passing on that buck the other day, if my dad would have been with me, he would have gave me a swift kick in the butt.
"So my question is this - which is more selfish? Telling your neighbor he can't shoot a young buck because you want him to grow old and shoot him for yourself, or telling him to shoot whatever makes him happy?" Really? You answered your own question. That's like asking a guy when He stopped beating his wife. You are also misinformed about QDM. Selfish would be having way too many DPSM and not taking antlerless for fear of running off a mature buck. Selfish is the neighbor who is too lazy or too ignorant to realize they have too many deer yet only take any buck. I could care less what neighbors do legally. Frankly in Wisconsin for 2014 QDM is a moot point. 1) Statewide either sex gun tags 2) Bonus Buck tags 3) Public land designated antlerless tags by property 4) Electronic registration (wink wink) The DNR scorched earth policy will take care of this discussion.
I am selfish - I want that big old smart buck all to myself...so I'd rather the neighbor fills his tag with a spike and will no longer be my competition. All in All - I have to agree with Dan...couldn't put it much better than that.
Greg, I thought it was just one person but there have surprisingly been a lot of people who seem to feel the same way. I'm just looking to see if there's anyone here who may be able to shed some more light on why they feel that way (in a slightly more intelligent response). Maybe I just put too much hope in people having an intelligent reason for their opinion. Oh, and I don't necessarily agree with someone shooting every 1 1/2 year old buck they see year in and year out if they're complaining about not seeing bigger bucks. In that case they're just contributing to their own problem. However if that's what they want to do and they're happy by all means have at it. Not everyone is a trophy hunter, I get that.
Only hunting 4+ year olds? I'd never shot a deer anywhere near where I live! I think it WOULD be selfish if I were a trophy hunter and I told my neighbors that they should only shot mature bucks. Realistically, most of us could not personally or in concert with others control enough property to grow and hunt only 4+ year old animals. QDM in and of itself is NOT trophy hunting although many people try to equate them. To me, it only makes sense to manage whatever property you have to it's best potential. Not all properties have the same capacity to hold and grow deer. Do what's best to keep deer in your area while still keeping the sex/age ratio somewhat in balance. I'm all for holding out for a big buck if I know one is around. I love venison, so at some point a decision needs to be made. Do I want meat or antlers? One year, it came down to the last 5 minutes of the last day. Shoot what makes you happy and don't look back!
I have heard quite a few people slam "Trophy Hunters". My question for people that are not trophy hunters why even kill bucks? Not sure what your buck to doe ratio in your area is.... Would it be wrong of me to ask those "non-trophy" hunters to kill only does?
I do everything I can to hold deer on my property and try to aid their diet for growth and health. I try to practice my own QDMA and take only mature animals or bigger bucks. I've passed on a huge number of small does and bucks. I've eaten tag soup from this practice, but I'm perfectly happy with that. However, there is a corporation farm that borders my land. I've seen them take does that barely have the spots off of them. They will shoot anything that walks. It's not their land, they don't care. I've talked to 2 of them and they are actually on board with me, mainly because they have property elsewhere and they're not going to waste a tag on a smaller animal. But there is still a handfull that doesn't care. It really pisses off both my neighbor and I. My neighbors only shoot big, mature bucks and are careful and ethical hunters. Neither of us agree with what these others do and would love for them to shoot onto our land so that we can end their hunting on the corporate land. All that said, am I wrong for getting upset? Maybe this fawn are what make them happy to shoot?
How is an inexperienced hunter going to know if a deer is a 4 year old? I have not been around the forums long but from the pics I have seen there are a lot of varying answers when determining an age of a buck or doe. This being my first year hunting and not being from a hunting family I will probably take the first decent shot I have at a doe. Some may not like that but thats fine. Each person hunts for an entirely different reason and who is to say that he or she is wrong.
I'm a big fan of APRs or OBRs but ultimately would never enforce either upon another as long as what they're doing is legal. It sucks but it's life that yeah some of the young bucks we "choose" to pass get shot by others...it's our choice what we shoot and it's their choice to shoot what they wish. If legal go for it, if interested in QDMA or why I choose to pass on younger bucks I'll share.
Well clearly the guy your talking to doesn't know what qdma is so don't lose sleep over it. IMO guys who "practice" QDMA on 100 acres is laughable. Unless you can manage to have all neighbors in concession on board, forget it. You can't manage on that small of a parcel. Because what you pass someone else will shoot on their property. As someone mentioned above most guys get 1-2 tags. And don't see deer as often as the tv shows that have 20 deer in 15 minutes of sitting down. To make any effort in managing anything you need 500+ acres. Even 1000+ is more like it. I get two tags every year. I try to take a doe early to fill the freezer. Then rest of the season I chase the dream buck. But by December if I haven't gotten that big buck I want ill fill the tag with whatever I am prou of. Not what anyone on a forum thinks is "proper". I see guys shooting fawns in the deer contest. QDMA is just another thing for rich guys with 20 farms to convince all their neighbors to not shoot any deer just so they can have them all. Most of us are lucky to see a decent buck let alone harvest one. Shoot straight!
Upset and frustration isn't wrong...if you do things against them or demean them in any way without them doing anything illegal or wrong (outside of opinion wrong/right) that's when it becomes wrong on your part.
Not everyone gets doe tags or has the option...We have not had public or private land doe tags in over 5 years. The only doe tags I get are deer management assistance tags for inside the city limit, bowhunting only, and a limited number of them. I personally have harvested 5-6 does to every buck for the last 10 years but the majority of hunters around here do not get that opportunity. Whether they only rifle hunt(which means bucks only), don't have any property to hunt inside the city limits, or can't obtain a tag. I don't know but maybe I am spoiled(or maybe just better at seeing bucks?). If I don't see at least 20-25 different bucks and pass on well over 20 easy opportunities(same bucks multiple times and carrying rifle, muzzleloader, or bow) then it's a really bad year. Thing is I hunted in the mid 80s when we were lucky to see one buck all season and then in the 90s there were so many deer I was getting firearm doe tags over the counter and shooting 7-8 deer a year(including 2 bucks) - now we are maybe 1/5 the population of the 90s but still 10 times what we had in the 80s. I still think people should be able to shoot what they want or whatever they legally can if it comes to that.
No it isn't. Laugh at it all you want but we attempt to adhere to a QDMA style mindset on my parents small 10 acre property and share the idea with neighbor's who wish to join. A QDMA cooperative is actually about to be born out of it. Is it "tougher" than owning say 500 or 1000 acres sure, but every time you pass a young buck that's a possible one more survivor. Neighbors that don't feel the same are going to shoot anything every year anyways so why turn their 4 or 5 yearling buck harvests into 8 or 9 or more by us also shooting yearlings. That's 4+ yearlings that have a much higher chance of survival than they would if we shot them.
Every hunter is at a different point. Bottom line is, shoot what makes you happy. I know hunters who will shoot any deer they see and I know others who won't shoot a deer under 3.5 Its a completely personal decision. Also I like what Dan said (which is very unusual).
