And now you have an armed teacher mistaking the principle for the intruder. You can make things as clear as you want in the training session but 2-3 years later I don't think they are remembering. Besides, if someone fancies themselves as Rambo then training won't matter. It will only take one bad incident with one armed teacher to make a mess that has everyone asking why we armed teachers to begin with.
On that not Bruce what if a teacher went on a shooting spree. They are just people and you never really know what's going on in peoples heads. Hell teachers get busted all the time sleeping with students, drugs, etc. Not really trying to come off insensitive just throwing another angle out there. We arm teachers and then one day one goes bat $hit and shoots someone....then what? Or the police respond to a shooting and shoot an armed teacher mistaking them for a shooter. Dynamic topic for sure, I don't know what to think sometimes.
You guys act like teachers can't go on shooting sprees because they aren't allowed to carry at work. Which is so naive I don't even have an analogy for it.
I don't disagree. However, the amount of practice and training and tested could be regulated. Only the proficient and those that pass would be allowed. I'm not even advocating it. I'm just pointing out that experience and proper training is what would make the difference. We send teachers to school for 4 years, this could be one of the optional classes to become certified. It could be given through that schools law enforcement department. Again, I'm not saying this is the answer, but it's something that we should look at. We should also look at a LEO, but one armed guard can be taken by surprise. Lets be honest, can you truly expect a LEO to be on guard 100% of the time in an environment where the likely hood of a gunman is so scarce? If I were the type of person planning a school shooting, and I knew there was an LEO, you can bet I would be planning on surprise attack on that person as a first priority, then I would have anywhere from 5 to 20 minutes to do whatever I wanted before the police would arrive to try and stop me. By that point, I would have been able to get back to my vehicle, get whatever my chosen weapons were and go wreck havoc. There's just no simple answer. Nothing, not one single law or multiple laws can stop this from happening. They can be a deterrent, and possible aid in stopping one from happening, but there is no fail safe from stopping this 100% of the time.
Not really what I meant. I guess I was thinking more of the armed teacher has a blow up with someone else at school and instead of it just being a blow up it turns into a shooting because "we" allowed a gun in a gun free zone. Imagine the media backlash on an event like that. Right or wrong the media is going to go for weeks with something like that. What about the armed teacher getting shot by police...then what? My point is there so many what ifs there is no real "solution" so to speak.
It's not a one and done type training...can't be in my opinion. We're talking about defending a school full of kids. Constant training would have to be mandatory in my opinion.
Actually, the point is teachers are no different than the rest of us and they can go on shooting sprees anytime, whether they carry at work or not, just like postal workers. You may want to look at how many workplace shootings there were in the last year by disgruntled employees. What is naive is thinking a training class will turn school teachers into competent bodyguards or think that because you (anyone) have a ccw you (anyone) are now competent enough to react correctly in a stressful, deadly situation.
True hence why it couldn't be a one and done thing and pre-required traiing and passing before allowed. Nothing is 100% guaranteed, but just like possibly getting rid of or making AR's harder to acquire legally is a preventative measure...this is as well.
I absolutely agree but you run the same risk anywhere and time you use a gun to protect. It is the biggest risk we take, but one worth taking imo. If the armed guard is taken out upon entry, a second line of defense would be nice. Again, more deterent. Definitely a complex issue with lots of emotions on both sides . I agree with Gary to an extent, some people don't have the mental makeup to handle the job of protecting in a high stress situation. Again, hopefully a training process would be put in place to weed them out. Kids should never see a weapon on a teacher or know who was carrying. I don't disagree with the concerns of the ones against teachers carying but I feel the positives outweigh the negative. Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2
We would be asking them to be bodyguards, real bodyguards. That is some serious training, not optional classes. If you were to have LEO's at the school you would have to have more than one and you would have to implement something MuzzyMan suggested, secure portals that were not easy to breach. Can you see doing that at every school? Tremendous cost in manpower and dollars. Where will all of that come from?
This could happen, no doubt, but lets not turn these insane shooters into super warriors that are now able to overpower trained LEO's and other security measures to get at the children and massacre them.
The thing that still jumps out at me is no matter what there is always a vulnerable area. Bus stops, recess, sport activities, dances, pta, beginning and the ending of the day, the list goes on. Anyway, I'm going hunting for a bit. You guys have this worked out and a plan ready to go by the time I get back Sunday, thanks.
The shooter at newport could have easily shot an armed guard at the front door with the first shot. Chances are he would be posted at the front door. Assault weapons probably would be replaced by pistols if armed guards are placed at the front door for concealment reasons. If the principle were armed, she would have ended it there. I agree that 2 LEO is the better option as well as lots of security measures. But lets be honest, the financial burden will probably keep it from happening. Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2
I won't clutter the forum with another topic, but thought this was of some interest. Please note, I've never watched this show, so I don't know how they portray gun ownership. http://www.foxnews.com/entertainmen...-ties-to-sandy-hook-say-show/?intcmp=features
LOL We can't even agree on fixed or mechanical. There will be no plan so just enjoy yourself, be happy you are no longer involved in this thread and good luck. Just remember, you can only shoot deer that we approve of.
Fun fact. There are at least 98,817 public schools in the US. If you paid each LEO $45,000 salary, that would be 4.45 billion dollars. Two LEO's would then obviously be a tax burden of 8.9 billion dollars. This does not include the additional benefits like the cost of insurance and paying for substitutes while these LEO that time off. Since, and including Columbine, there have been 4 mass shootings that involved primary schools. A few more for college/universities. Obviously that is too many, but we are attacking this like it is a common occurrence, which is simply not what it is. Statistics state that on average 12 Americans are murdered daily by illegal aliens, yet this administration is unwilling to talk about immigration reform. That over 4300 Americans killed each year(on average) by people that are not even supposed to be here, yet nothing is being done about it. In fact just the opposite, they want to give them citizenship and a right to vote. Nearly 800,000 babies are aborted in this country yearly so that a woman can "have the right to choose". All of which can be done without consent or knowledge of the father. I couldn't even have a vasectomy without my wife authorizing it. I don't care what you stance is on abortion. The facts are that is a living organism at the time of abortion and if left alone will develop into you and if given the time to grow. What about their choice? There are many injustices and tragedies in this world, but yet you government stays silent on these because doing the right thing will not gain them any votes from their constituents. So unless they start to address these issues, don't talk to me about gun control.
No am not, I am saying just because someone states they can do it, does not mean they should. We all talk a good game. BTW I still hold the reccord for Longest TD and most TD receptions at my school, I got skills Nuns at my daughters school would kick anyones ***
I am only protecting me and my family, I am not resposible for 30 kids in a class or 500 in a school.
