Do's & Don'ts: starting over at the pro shop

Discussion in 'Intro to Bowhunting & Archery' started by BlackHelicopter, May 21, 2021.

  1. BlackHelicopter

    BlackHelicopter Newb

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    Getting back into bowhunting after a long hiatus. I'll soon be going to a local archery shop, one that I'm told has a good reputation, to shop for my new compound bow.

    One thing that I didn't like before about the sport was the juggling act of draw weight/broadhead weight/spine, and trying to balance all that out. For this reason, I am going to the pro shop with the intention of buying the bow, arrows, broadheads, and sight system. I'm fine paying retail to have a pro set me up for success.

    Having said all that... does anybody here have any advice on what I should, and should not, do/say when shopping from scratch like I am? Again, this place has a solid reputation, but figured I'd ask for some thoughts.

    What I do know about my setup is I want to go the Dr. Ashby route (650 grain arrows, single bevel broadheads). Have also been advised by friends to shoot lots of bows and lean towards a more forgiving bow (longer axis and brace height).

    Thank you!
     
  2. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

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    As for arrow and spine we will need to know DW and DL. IBO or a tested speed would help also. What's your budget(bare bow, or with all accoutrements.)
    Do you have a brand of bow or shaft that you like?
     
  3. BlackHelicopter

    BlackHelicopter Newb

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    Budget.... I'm willing to spend about $1,200. Plus I have a bunch of Cabela's points I can use for buying a target, case, other needed odds-n-ends.

    Brand of equipment, I'm wide open. I like what I've read about Ashby, but I know not everybody subscribes to that. Plan on asking a lot of questions and listening.
     
  4. Sota

    Sota Legendary Woodsman

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    Do not buy your bow at Cabelas
     
  5. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

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    Ok first go try a **** ton of bows on the range you like.
    Figure out your DL and prefer DW
    Narrow it down to top 3 bows, come here and post them and then promptly disregard all the dumbass comments of advice and buy the one the"sings" to you.
    Once that is done come tell us what have ava we can figure out arrows for what you wanna accomplish.

    Let's meet back here in 1 week
     
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  6. BlackHelicopter

    BlackHelicopter Newb

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    Since I want to go the heavy arrow route, is there any validity to finding my draw length, then building the arrow, and THEN using those arrows on different bows to see feels right?

    BTW - Fix, thanks for the help. I noticed you're in WNY, funny, I grew up in Buffalo.
     
  7. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

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    When you go to pick a bow I would focus on the smoothness of the cycle and back wall, balance, and release shock.
    #NYStrong... Except for Cuomo( that guy can eat a bagofdicks )
     
  8. dnoodles

    dnoodles Grizzled Veteran

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    No, not really because each bow could "like" an arrow more or less than the other and you could really limit your bow selection or even waste all that money on a dozen custom arrows and not find a bow that really likes them. You're really putting the cart before the horse if you build an arrow system first.

    While a bow will feel different launching a 340gr TAW vs. a 650gr TAW, prior to the actual release the draw cycle will feel the same either way. Draw cycle is the biggest "feel factor" when it comes to buying a bow, IMO. Hand shock and noise are not as important as the draw cycles.

    So, go with Fix's advice (hurt to say, lol) and find the bow that you like the draw cycle best, shooting an approximate grain arrow to what you plan to go with. That will give you a baseline from which to fine tune your arrow selection.

    You can fix or deal with a loud bow with some handshock by shooting heavier arrows and throwing on some dampeners and a stab. You cannot fix a crappy draw cycle (with a few exceptions.)

    As an example, I am currently shooting a 2018 Bowtech Realm. I had no intention of buying a Bowtech when I went into the shop, I was a Mathews guy and expected to buy a Triax. But the Bowtech stomped the Triax with it's draw cycle and especially the rock solid back wall. Made 70# feel like drawing and holding 60#. But it was really loud and shocky upon release.

    Some BowJax limb dampeners, a quality stab, and bumping up to 600gr arrows later, that thing is dead in the hand and just makes a dull "thump" on release.

    I might not buy another Bowtech, but I will never buy another bow without a solid back wall.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2021
  9. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

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    IMG_20210523_155920.gif
     
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  10. stanlh

    stanlh Newb

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    As others said shoot several bows if you can to see what likes you. The big three are Mathews, Hoyt, and Elite. No doubt that will start an argument. There are other good manufacturers out there, but these are three whose bows you should consider.
    If you intend to hunt try to find a pro shop that has bow hunters on staff to help you. You can get some good up to date information this way.
    A lot has changed in just a few years, don't know how long you have been out of it, but sounds like some time. So lots of new products and information for you to assimilate. Don't limit yourself to an Ashby approach on arrow selection. A good shop can set you up with arrows that will work for you and they don't have to weight 650 grains. You will be happier. Luck to you.
     
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  11. BlackHelicopter

    BlackHelicopter Newb

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    Update: I bought a Hoyt Torrex XT today.

    I test shot a PSE, Matthews, and 2 different Hoyts at the 60# draw weight. I was told I have a 29" draw length.

    The Hoyts just felt smoother and so in a way, easier. The other Hoyt was something like $1,100 and after shooting both back and forth, I just thought "Yeah, I don't feel any $400 difference". So, the Torrex XT won out.

    Now... I would appreciate advice from everybody here on the accessories. Specifically, what should I be considering for a sight and rest? I can tell you that I like to keep things simple. Years back on my old bow I just used 3 pins, and when back east it was only 2. I don't plan to push the envelope at longer distances. I'm curious what folks feel is the easiest, pragmatic hunting sights and rest setup.

    Thank you!
     
  12. wl704

    wl704 Legendary Woodsman

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    Sight - are you looking to stick with fixed? I have single pin hha sliders that I like, though they are a bit of a challenge out west...have been thinking of moving to a spot hogg or MBG.

    Rest - HDX.
     
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  13. Mod-it

    Mod-it Die Hard Bowhunter

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    I would also recommend a QAD HDX rest. Just make sure to not get the lowest level QAD, as they don't have the anti bounce for the launcher arm and many complain of the rest bouncing back up and contacting their fletchings/arrow before it has left the bow.
    Many really like limb driven rests these days. I've never used one and have no experience with one as of yet.

    Sights really come down to preference. HHA, Montana Black Gold, and Spot Hogg are all very good/robust and have great reputations for being dependable and great customer service should it become necessary. With what you said you've used in the past I'd recommend a two or three pin hybrid type sight. For example, on a 3 pin hybrid sight you'd set two of the pins for a fixed distance such as 20 & 30 yards and then the 3rd pin is a floater that can be dialed to 35-60 yards (or farther) just like a movable sight.
    A Spot Hogg "double pin" sight may also appeal to you.
    I have an Option sight. It is nice but they are spendy. I got lucky and found a used one for about half price. They are the best of both worlds, they are both a multiple fixed pin sight and a single pin movable sight all in one. Mine is set up with 3 fixed pins and one mover pin. If you do look for a used one make sure it isn't the 1st generation of this sight. The upgraded ones are simply better with the changes they made to them.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2021
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  14. BlackHelicopter

    BlackHelicopter Newb

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    Appreciate the comments, gives me something to research this weekend. Thanks guys!

    # of pins? I'm thinking 3, fixed. I was shown at the range for the first time whatever that setup is where you have several pins, but then can adjust out (sliders? movers?). I'll have to look into it but at first glance, that appears more complicated than anything I want to mess with when I have an animal in front of me. Yes, I do plan on doing some 3-d shoots (my buddies go), but I'm not even going to worry about the >40 yards thing.

    Rests... I've heard there are cable rests and limb driven rests. No idea what those are, but I'm going to cyber research this weekend.
     
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  15. Mod-it

    Mod-it Die Hard Bowhunter

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    Read up on the 3 pin movable sights, you actually wouldn't need to touch them while hunting if you didn't want to. With you saying you really don't care to shoot over 40 yards, you could use the top pin as your "floater" pin and then adjust the other two for whatever yardage as your fixed pins. For example, you set the top floater pin for 15 yards and then have the next two "fixed" pins at 25 and 35. All you'd have to do is make sure your top floater pin is dialed to 15 yards on the yardage tape and then just go hunt as if you're using a 3 pin fixed sight. But then when at a 3d shoot you could just dial your top pin to whatever yardage the target is and use it as if it is a single pin movable sight. No having to gap pins like with a fixed sight (at least until you max out the sight range anyway).
    Of course choose whatever you want, just wanted to give an example and let you know that a hybrid sight can be used as if it's a fixed pin sight if you want.

    A cable driven rest is a drop away rest that has a cord that gets attached to the cable on your bow, usually they are about even with the bottom of your bow grip area. When you draw, the bow cable slides down and this pulls the launcher arm on the rest up into position. Very important to have it "timed" correctly. You need to apply some felt or mole skin to the launcher area where your arrow sits or else it'll make noise when you draw.

    A limb driven rest is the same concept, but it has a longer cord that attaches to your limb and it is what activates the launcher arm when you draw. They are all the rage right now. I've honestly never had an issue with my QAD cable driven rest and see no reason to "fix what ain't broke" at this point in time. I do have a new bow on order though and may try a limb driven when it finally comes in.

    By the way, good to see a fellow Idahoan on here. I'm 5 hours north of you in Lewiston.
     
  16. BlackHelicopter

    BlackHelicopter Newb

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    Mod-It - thanks for the post! Yes, good to see others from the Gem State here.

    Question for all... releases. When I was testing the bows at the range, I had something that buckled around my wrist and a rather small mechanical device for the release itself. When taking a quick look at releases, it seems some go around the wrist and other, what... kinda T shaped and not attached to the wrist.

    I used the latter when bowhunting in the 90s, but maybe those wrist ones are better now? What's the advantage? I wonder about the wrist ones getting in the way if I'm walking and moving around (not hunting from a tree stand). But... maybe they are nice because they are always there.

    I'm sure there are fans of both, but for a mobile western hunter, what might you suggest?

    Thanks again for the posts everybody!
     
  17. BlackHelicopter

    BlackHelicopter Newb

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    Also, any suggestions on a quality bow case?
     
  18. Mod-it

    Mod-it Die Hard Bowhunter

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    I started with a wrist strap index type release and have always just stayed with it. The majority of my archery hunting is elk during the rut, so I'm mobile much more than I sit. I've thought about a hand held type release but I just find that having my release strapped on and ready at all times is convenient and familiar.
    I currently have my most favorite one I've ever used. It is a Tru-fire that has the ability to fold back the opposite way. I really like to have it folded back out of the way of my hand when removing an arrow from the quiver and nocking it. Having it back out of the way keeps it from clinking around and making noise. With it folded back I often forget it's even there.
     
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  19. BlackHelicopter

    BlackHelicopter Newb

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    Thanks Mod!

    So, I just ordered a Tru-Fire Hardcore Buckle Foldback. We'll see how that goes.

    I also understand that some of these initial gear selections just can't be based on experience. Ill use them and if I want something else, I'll just have to eBay them and get something else.

    The bow shop called today, they have a sight and rest system installed (can't even remember what it is). I'm getting there.

    For arrow selection.... that'll be last. I guess not everybody is a fan of heavy, high FOC arrows, but that's the direction I want to go.
     
  20. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

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    Well when you get to the next decision throw out some ideas and we can assist.
     

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