Do you have realistic expectations for the ground you hunt?

All of us would like to kill a nice buck. A buck that is better than average for our part of the country.
Some places that might be a 120 or 130, and in the best hunting areas 140 -150’s seem to be the measuring stick for a lot of guys.

I got to thinking about a statement made in another post about hunting fence lines and how hard it can be to take a nice buck on small tracts of ground.

In Indiana we a have pretty good deer herd. That being said we still only have maybe 30-35 deer PSM in the better areas. That comes out to around 1 deer per every 18-20 acres. In the best habitat 3 to 4 might be on 20 acres and our buck to doe ratio is probably 1-4 or higher in most places.

I put these numbers on paper based on the PSM assumptions above with best case numbers. I am also assuming that most guys hunting private ground hunt on 20 - 300 acres.

20 acres = 3 deer – 1 buck – 2 does
40 acres = 6 deer – 2 bucks (1 yearling & 1 2 year or older) - 4 does
100 acres = 15 deer - 4 bucks (2 yearling & 2- 2 year or older) - 11 does
300 acres = 45 deer - 12 bucks (6 yearlings, 4 - 2 year or older & 2 3 year or older) – 33 does.

Looking at these numbers the odds seem to really stink when you hunting smaller pieces of ground.

Just a note--- I ran this scenario against my situation and the property I had to hunt on to see if it fit.

3000 acres = 450 deer – 120 bucks (60 yearlings, 40 - 2 year or older & 20 3 year or older) – 330 does

Our inventory of trail cams showed that we had 17 - 2 year olds, 7 - 3 year olds & 3 - 4+ year old bucks. I am sure that we did not catch all the buck running the place on our cams.

Of this known number we shot 8 bucks last year; 3 - 2 year olds, 4 - 3 year olds and 2 4+ year old.
We also took an additional 3 that were transient from other properties that came on us during the rut.

The question is—does your expectation to take a nice buck meet reality for the ground you have access to hunt on?

 

Your math assumes someone's 20 acre property is an island not surrounded by other land.

 

I agree it looks that way, but the neighboring ground will hold the same number as the 20 acres I originally state...

With cores being up to a mile (640 acres) for a buck --- the math says you may not even see the one residing on your 20 acres in a given year while hunting...

 

I expect to kill a buck over 120" every year on my property. I hunt 40 acres. I generally get somewhere in the neighborhood of 20-40 different bucks on trail camera during the preseason, maybe more. Of that number, I usually have 6 to 12 that will be 130" plus. Some seasons I see several of these bucks during the hunting season, other years I hardly see any. Last season, I only saw one shooter buck the entire season. I would say my 40 acres hunts better than average for a piece of property this size. I do think my expectations are realistic because I have the trail camera data to back up the fact that I have multiple shooter bucks that frequent my land. I don't expect to shoot deer over 160". They are in the neighborhood, but they do not seem to use my smaller tract of land. They seem to stick to the deeper woods area. I friend of mine passed a 170" buck one week and killed him a week later less than a half mile from my property. I had never seen him before.

 

I think for a blanket generalization I would agree somewhat.

I think adding a negative or positve multiplier for what is contiguous would get you closer and take into consideration how many acres are huntable on the specific site would also help.

I hunt an 80 acre parcel that is all farmland except for a treeline and ditch. (?)

I hunt a 30 acre parcel that is attached to over 400 acres of timber. (?) - I would much rather have access to that 30 acres versus a ton of larger parcels.

 

That's great.. I'd expect you have put a lot of effort into making your ground prime habitat for the deer year around.

 

The right habitat mix is key... large or small...

 

No doubt. I have certainly seen an increase in number and quality of deer since I have been managing the property. But, location and surrounding habitat plays a very large role in the quality of the property. I got pretty lucky getting this particular piece of ground.

 

That makes sense to me. but is this improved land? or existing untouched?
I own 40 acres, have permission to hunt the adjoining 100 acres...and surrounded by a thousand acres of non buildable wetland and swamp. I've owned the property for 2 years this september. i noticed the first late fall, that my land was lacking bedding areas but didnt want to jump the gun and go chainsaw crazy, so i waited a year and learned the strengths the property DID have and went from there. I spent this past winter hinge cutting and making bedding areas. I have 5 known bucks and double that with does, that now travel through/bed on near my land. who knows, i'm sure there is more. ( i did find sheds in bedding areas i made!!!) the bucks range in age, and there's an old bruiser that knows what he is doing. i was only having 3 known bucks frequent my land then down to 2 after my september 20th buck. But in late november when i started hinge cutting a few more bucks i never saw before moved in. The 2-3 year old bucks i've noticed are very easy to pattern early season, which is how and why i scored early last year and will do the same again this year. I'll also be keeping an eye out late october early november for the big guy who has me pegged. starting this season i am only hunting 1-2 spots on my property only about 30 yards inside the woodline from my backyard to minimize pressure, and let the deer feel safe in the created habitat. My neighbor in the back is a trigger happy meat hunter, (nothing wrong with that)so i think that i have created alot of sucess for him by going deep into my property pushing the deer to him. all in all I'm expecting a banner year this season...LOL!!!
Sorry I'm Rambling......

This is in Rhode Island, so these are all great bucks.

2 year old...expecting better things from him this year


this guy will be my target buck this year...he was one of the new guys to move in. i found one of his sheds, and i love the tall tight rack.


this is the other new buck


Mr. smarty pants.....(chunk)


the early season buck i shot last year on september 20th.

 

My original OP was for unimproved habitat.... When you start adding in improvements (hinge cutting, food plots) then carrying capacity increases along with the deer numbers improving.

Great small parcels usually have surrounding habitat that helps support larger deer numbers.

Sounds like your swap area is key to the success of your 40 acres producing!

 

From my personal experience, since I started using quality deer management tactics to improve my property and make it more suitable for deer, I have noticed a big improvement in the deer herd. I've noticed that not only do I see healthy/bigger deer or random deer that I haven't seen before, but I am seeing the same deer over and over again, which tells me that deer are making my property either their home or part of their regular route. I'm pretty proud of the work we've done because knowing that deer have such a large range, having the same deer on camera on a 9 acre piece of property on a daily basis can only be good news.

 

Spear-- how many deer do you think stay on your piece of ground 75% of the time?

Are most of them passing through , feeding or living there from what you can tell?

 

I've got 2 yearlings who lost their mother last year (when they were fawns) who have never left my property. I literally see them every time I'm there and their bedding is at the back of my property, possibly a little deeper into the property behind mine but they eat, drink, and roam my property. I also have 3 (3.5 by bow season ) year old brothers that I get on multiple different cameras on a daily basis who I also saw multiple times last year. But I don't think they are bedding down on my property, they just pass through on a daily basis. Beyond that we have 3 does who are always on camera together (so I can only assume it's them every time), but likewise they aren't actually living on my property, just daily visits (morning and afternoon).

EDIT: So having said all that, there are 2 deer that are on my property 75% of their time or more. I imagine as they get older I expect their range to broaden, but they will never go far, my property is what they know and their mother has been gone since they were fawns.

 

That's the thing about small parcels.. They tend to be pass through areas usually,as they are just not big enough to be permanent cores for deer to stay on. Improving the habitat will help, and it sounds like you have a great plan in the works.

Creating bedding areas is something I have been working on here lately... The thicker and nastier they are the better they hold deer.

My best success so far is to have two smaller thick bedding areas joined by a narrow strip of Egyptian wheat or tall grasses. They seem to run back and forth between them when busted up but don't run completely out of the area....

 

Well I thought I had a decent deer heard till I see these numbers. I lease out 600 acres and from the trail cameras I would say at most diffrent deer. Given probably only 95 acres of the 600 is timber. Since I have been leasing (3 years) the famer has shot 4- 2 1/2 year olds and 2 does. I havent taken any because I target specific deer on there.

 

Basically you have 100 acres if there is no surrounding timber or good habitat for other deer to live on.. Your number aren't that far off really.

 

yeah nothing real close just maybe 5acre parcels then about a mile south there is a 150 acre parcell of timber. There is no way I could imagine killing 15 deer a year off that property. But im not going to complain at all each year I have had average 3-5 shooters (at least 3 1/2year olds). For our area I am doing a lot better then all the other people I talk to.

 

Sounds like it.. Sounds like your expectations line up to me!

 

What if my "neighboring ground" is a 300 acre farm? What if I have bedding areas and the neighbor has crops? Your theory still assumes all parcels are the same size and they are all segmented to prevent movement among them.

 

I for one don't believe in the core area concept as crops change and acorns come and go with good years and bad,bucks get close to the rut and breakup the bachelor groups and some deer vanish as others show up from other ground. As long as deer have legs there is always a chance for a new deer I have never seen before just breaking a twig at anytime next to my stand.