Are Crossbows Becoming Too Efficient for Archery Season?

Discussion in 'Bowhunting Talk' started by Bowhunting.com Staff, May 28, 2019.

  1. fletch920

    fletch920 Grizzled Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2009
    Posts:
    8,666
    Likes Received:
    3,636
    Dislikes Received:
    40
    Location:
    iowa
    It was very clearly answered. Because not everyone wants to do the same thing. So, an able bodied person can enjoy hunting with any weapon they choose. Your presumption is that people choose to shoot a crossbow because it is easier. That is an illogical conclusion and only fits a percentage of those that hunt with a crossbow. Also, a crossbow is inherently more accurate than someone with a vertical bow. So, even if some nimrod wants to take pot shots at wild animals, statistically they are going to have more success with the crossbow. I find it easier to get into position for the shot with a vertical bow, but once in position, the crossbow is much more accurate. If and when you ever hunt with one, you will understand exactly what I am talking about. I hope for your sake, that you don't have to use one for a very long time.

    I don't have to deflect, I have killed deer with both styles of bow and know exactly how they handle in hunting situations. And by the way, my crossbow sounds like a .22 going off. Anything but quiet. But, I know you were only trying to belittle my comment about crippling. So be it. Enjoy your weekend, I am out of here early to go enjoy a beautiful day at the cabin.
     
  2. Shane0709

    Shane0709 Die Hard Bowhunter

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2014
    Posts:
    1,773
    Likes Received:
    2,300
    Dislikes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Illinois
    Lol... this is NOT something I want to get caught up in. Who thought reintroducing this absolute war was an acceptable idea anyway? Haha


    Sent from my iPhone using Bowhunting.com Forums
     
    Fix likes this.
  3. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2016
    Posts:
    6,357
    Likes Received:
    7,372
    Dislikes Received:
    23
    Location:
    Western NY
    My point !
     
  4. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2016
    Posts:
    6,357
    Likes Received:
    7,372
    Dislikes Received:
    23
    Location:
    Western NY
    I disagree with Fletch and pray that the next time he laughs at me he sheets himself but I must say every crossbow I have seen is stupid loud. Like, quiet night hear it hundreds of yards off loud.
     
    fletch920 likes this.
  5. GregH

    GregH Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2008
    Posts:
    13,670
    Likes Received:
    34,447
    Dislikes Received:
    22
    I was not belittling your comment about crippling. I was only saying that you cannot state your opinions as guaranteed fact without proof.

    Here is a quote from a crossbow manufacturer Dave Robb....

    "Most bowhunters start dropping out of the sport when they reach their 40s," says TenPoint's Robb. "Partly it's physical, but partly it's because their complex lifestyles don't leave them the time they had as a younger person to hone their archery skills. Rather than going out there and being irresponsible, trying to kill a deer with a compound bow, they opt out. We give them a tool that, with a minimal amount of practice, allows them to participate and be successful. They still have to locate game and stalk within range, but the main advantage of a crossbow is that it doesn't require the same amount of time and skill to get and maintain proficiency."

    It looks like there might be something to my "presumption" of the easy button after all. Right from the horses mouth!
     
  6. fletch920

    fletch920 Grizzled Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2009
    Posts:
    8,666
    Likes Received:
    3,636
    Dislikes Received:
    40
    Location:
    iowa
    Like I said, it only fits a percentage. Are all crossbow shooters over 40? Does the guy that works 60 or more hours a week not deserve to hunt an archery season? Try it once before you judge. It is not what you and I once thought. Trust me as an old timer on that. I once shared your view. I will admit to being dead wrong.
     
  7. virginiashadow

    virginiashadow Legendary Woodsman

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2009
    Posts:
    22,303
    Likes Received:
    26,254
    Dislikes Received:
    24
    He ain't using no bow anymore![​IMG]

    Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
     
    Okiebob and Swamp Stalker like this.
  8. buckeye

    buckeye Grizzled Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2008
    Posts:
    7,616
    Likes Received:
    710
    Dislikes Received:
    1
    Location:
    The OH-IO
    Speaking of percentages... Slipknot has a new album coming out in August and percentages show I am 100% pumped. The new song Unsainted is DAF. Will most definitely be part of my 2019 season soundtrack.
     
  9. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2016
    Posts:
    6,357
    Likes Received:
    7,372
    Dislikes Received:
    23
    Location:
    Western NY
    Spit It Out https://g.co/kgs/8NNTrT
     
  10. Fix

    Fix Grizzled Veteran

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2016
    Posts:
    6,357
    Likes Received:
    7,372
    Dislikes Received:
    23
    Location:
    Western NY
    It's number 1 in my workout mix .... Still
     
  11. tracker1

    tracker1 Newb

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2012
    Posts:
    9
    Likes Received:
    7
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Just like other archery sites when someone wants to stir the pot and marginalize other hunters to make themselves feel superior they start a crossbow thread, and other like minded people chime in never thinking about the elderly archers that been killing deer with traditional gear for many years or disabled and handicapped hunters, many of which don’t even look handicapped. How do you think they must feel when they come across a thread like this one.
    From my perspective, starting bow hunting 50 years ago and seeing how things started with a longbows, no sights, and wooden arrow and a sharp piece of metal for a broadhead, I could say the same about modern compound bows. The only separation from a modern compound and a crossbow to me is the draw, and that’s gone shooting out of a blind or high up in a tree stand. With some years of experience knowing how to draw on an animal plus 80%-90% let off bows the gap between a high tech compound bows and crossbows narrows significantly.
     
  12. NorthmanJW

    NorthmanJW Weekend Warrior

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2020
    Posts:
    184
    Likes Received:
    114
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Northern NY
    I never knew how hostile this topic makes people until I started a poll online. I figured I'd check and see if there was discussion on here about it. The comments I was getting where crazy! I have owned crossbows before, killed with them, and enjoyed shooting them. However I do not put them in the archery category. Similar to how I feel about in-line muzzleloaders, when you can shoot 250 yards with one, you might as well use a center fire rifle. I personally believe crossbows, and in-lines are in their own categories. Ok, let me have it!

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G925A using Bowhunting.com Forums mobile app
     
  13. John T.

    John T. Die Hard Bowhunter

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2018
    Posts:
    1,191
    Likes Received:
    509
    Dislikes Received:
    1
    Crossbows are part of hunting...period and here to stay. I read of BHers taking shots to 80 yards. When I started into archery about years ago, a 40 yard shot was a long one. Here in East Tennessee, average shot is about 19 yards.
     
  14. NorthmanJW

    NorthmanJW Weekend Warrior

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2020
    Posts:
    184
    Likes Received:
    114
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Northern NY
    That's way too far for my comfort. I draw the line at 50 yards max. I always try to wait or move up to get inside 30 yards. Too much can go wrong in the time it takes the arrow to reach the target over 50 in my opinion.

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G925A using Bowhunting.com Forums mobile app
     
    oldnotdead likes this.
  15. nickster

    nickster Weekend Warrior

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2011
    Posts:
    80
    Likes Received:
    13
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    tallahassee, florida
    this is just like the evolution of muzzle loaders, from the original designs to in lines with scoped optics and bullet designs. its your personal preference. more states are limiting their gun seasons so why not as long as the harvest data supports it .
     
    Shocker99 and oldnotdead like this.
  16. Michael.herb

    Michael.herb Weekend Warrior

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2014
    Posts:
    100
    Likes Received:
    6
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Legal and ethical decisions are what's important. We each have different abilities, capabilities, goals, and personal preferences. I've personally never used a crossbow but that is no reason to belittle another hunters decision or preference.
    Illegal or unethical issues affect our community, not personally preference.

    Sent from my SM-G960U using Bowhunting.com Forums mobile app
     
    Shocker99 and oldnotdead like this.
  17. BearArcher

    BearArcher Weekend Warrior

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2014
    Posts:
    103
    Likes Received:
    7
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Missouri
    There are a couple of things I would like to address when it comes down to an individuals choice to use a crossbow or vertical bow. I have used both and I am familiar with both and several things jump out to me.

    1. The range of a crossbow is frequently overstated especially if you don't have one of the expensive high end options. And even then, 50 yards should be the maximum distance that a live animal is shot at with any archery equipment in my opinion. Beyond 50 yards, the flight time of the arrow or bolt starts to become long enough that an animal can take a step, whirl to run away at the sound of the shot, or otherwise move in a way that turns a perfectly well aimed shot into a gut shot, leg shot, or other less than ideal hit. It's one thing to stack arrows or bolts on a static target 100 yards away but quite another thing to hit live moving animals at that distance. My personal maximum with either my compound or my crossbow is 40 yards. The other aspect that often gets overlooked is the trajectory of the bolt. Not everyone has or takes shots that are in a wide open field with nothing between the shooter and the animal. If you are hunting in the woods and attempt a long range shot, chances are that as the bolt rises far above the line of sight to hit dead on at 75-100 yards, it will get deflected by branches, vines, leaves, etc. Where the trajectory of a rifle allows you to pick a hole through the brush and thread the needle, that can't be done with a crossbow at longer ranges. Heck, I took a shot at a turkey last year with my crossbow at 35 yards and had the bolt hit a branch above the line of sight and deflect bad enough to miss the turkey by 10 feet.

    2. The difficulty of drawing a compound bow when a deer is present is usually overstated. I mostly hunt from the ground (no blind, just a leafy camo suit) and even then, drawing the bow while deer are within range just isn't the big deal it is made out to be. Yes, you have to pick the right time such as when the deer's head is behind a tree, down below the level of the grass/brush, or when it turns so that it's head is behind it's body blocking it's view of you. But it isn't incredibly difficult. When you add a tree stand to the mix and are 15-20 feet above ground level, it is even easier to do. The supposed advantage of the crossbow not needing to be drawn when the deer is present is negligible at best and grossly overstated.

    3. Scopes or optics on a crossbow aren't really a huge advantage. First off, magnification isn't needed at 50 yards and in. I could argue that a 4 power scope at those ranges is a disadvantage over no magnification at all. My crossbow has a red dot sight on it that has 3 dots in the non magnified window. A dot for 20 yards, 30 yards, and 40 yards. Not all that different than looking through the peep sight on my compound bow and seeing lighted pins for 20 yards, 30 yards, and 40 yards. If shots are kept within 50 yards (40 yards and in even better) as I stated in point number 1, the sighting system used whether crossbow or compound bow is mostly irrelevant. At those ranges any sighting system will work just as well as any other when the target is the size of a deer's chest and you aren't trying to shoot something as small as a squirrel's head or something.

    4. Crossbows do give people the ability to ethically archery hunt when they are unable to practice as often as they need to with a vertical bow. There are many reasons that someone may not be able to put in the practice time with a vertical bow that has nothing to do with being lazy or anything negative like that. Some have been mentioned already and include work schedule, family commitments (multiple younger kids involved in after school activities or caring for an elderly parent for example), old injuries that might not rise to the level of needing to go to a doctor but still may affect the repeated drawing of a bow, lack of a safe place to practice regularly, and for me personally - target panic. If you have never experienced target panic when shooting a vertical bow, I hope you never do. And if you have and you have beat it, good on you. I have tried everything including blind bale shooting, drawing multiple times without firing, and several other suggestions. But with my compound bow, the more I shoot it, the worse my target panic kicks in. This creates issues when shooting in my back yard at a bag target as an errant arrow glancing off the target could leave my yard and hit something or someone outside my property. Therefore, I would often hunt with my compound bow after very little practice in the summer. Not ideal. The crossbow allows me to practice in my backyard without the fear of the errant shot caused by target panic and allows me to be a more ethical archery hunter when I enter the woods.

    I find that the crossbow does have some disadvantages when compared to my compound bow. It is easier to move through the woods with the vertical bow. Much less awkward to carry than a crossbow. Getting off a second shot at a missed deer is much easier with a vertical bow. Darn near impossible with a crossbow. Other than that, I consider them to be about equal and don't consider one better than the other just a little different. If it weren't for target panic I may have stayed with the compound. But I'm glad that Missouri gave me the option to use the crossbow in 2016. And I certainly don't look down on anyone for using a crossbow for any reason and don't think their inclusion during archery season is a negative.
     
    Shocker99 and Justin like this.
  18. Vabowman

    Vabowman Grizzled Veteran

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2009
    Posts:
    3,382
    Likes Received:
    1,264
    Dislikes Received:
    4
    Location:
    Southeast Va
    my experience with hunting with people that use xbows.. they typically don't get in my way at all. the guys I hunt with are just too damn lazy to walk far. they use xbows and sit on powerlines, and fields and clear cuts. they all 100% say they have shoulder issues... they also all admit that it is much more accurate and just plain easier to use.. Me? I will hunt with a vertical bow for as long as possible...even if I have to only pull 35#. most of the grown men that I hunt with that use a xbow can easily pull upwards of 50+ pounds. How do I know? because I see them carry in heavy ass ladder stands and hang them. i see them using climbers, and i see them dragging deer and hanging them up...most importantly, they tell me they can pull the weight, but they have gotten used to the xbow and it's killing range and accuracy. one of my buddies I hunt with is a fireman, my age, 45, in shape, had shoulder surgery 2 years ago..he went to a xbow...he told me the other day, he was in the gym pressing 115 lb dumbells for reps...and he looked at me and said, yeh, I can pull any weight I want, but I just use the xbow now... so, with that, yes xbows are very efficient killing machines. too efficient? maybe, but to be honest so is the modern compound compared to 20-25 years ago. and certainly when compared with traditional bows.. I admit it, I tried the traditional thing for a season, it was too much for me. too hard, I opted to go back to the medium skill required vertical bow. sue me
     
  19. BearArcher

    BearArcher Weekend Warrior

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2014
    Posts:
    103
    Likes Received:
    7
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Missouri
    Vaboman - your signature line reads "Getting close to game is the essence of bowhunting". For the record, I have killed 4 deer with a crossbow, all from the ground and not in a ground blind. The ranges to those deer are as follows:

    1st deer - 17 yards
    2nd deer - 30 yards
    3rd deer - 26 yards
    4th deer - 13 yards

    I have killed 5 deer with a compound bow. Same scenario. All from the ground and no ground blind. Except the 4th deer. I was in a low tree stand that was only about 8 feet or so off of the ground and the deer was uphill from me so the shot was a pretty level shot and not shooting down. Ranges as follows:

    1st deer - 25 yards
    2nd deer - 20 yards
    3rd deer- 22 yards
    4th deer - 30 yards
    5th deer - 21 yards

    I killed the 5 compound bow deer first and then switched to a crossbow and killed the other 4 deer last. As you can see, switching to a crossbow didn't change the way I hunt and didn't see me suddenly killing deer at extended ranges. Still getting close and the experience is the same. I have killed 21 other deer with a variety of different guns and from my perspective, the crossbow kills are much more similar to the compound bow than they are to any of the gun deer kills. And I am not saying that you specifically said this but that is why when I hear people say that using a crossbow is just like using a gun I have to wonder if the people saying that have hunted with a bow, crossbow, and gun and actually compared the experiences before they make that statement. Because if they did, I don't think they would make that statement based on my experiences.
     
  20. 0317

    0317 Die Hard Bowhunter

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2020
    Posts:
    1,283
    Likes Received:
    836
    Dislikes Received:
    15
    Location:
    Midwest
    Crossbows ?? .. I DESPISE the damn things always have, always will .. they do NOT belong in regular archery seasons, they need to go with the rest of the shoulder fired hunting tools (Firearms season) ... I'm 62, I will use a vertical bow until I cant draw any longer, then and only then I will go back to firearms, as there isnt any hiding what they are ... the crossbow kill has now surpassed the vertical bow kill here in Indiana as those people want easy ... there are now more using them on state lands walking around like Elmer Fudds, disrupting regular BOWhunters, many are gun hunters who have now moved into the early archery seasons, thus crowding the lands even more ... even with a bad shoulder, I will continue to shoot and hunt a vertical bow, just at a lower poundage ... I sold crossbows for many years, and know exactly how damn easy they are to use, if I wanted easy, I'd have stayed a gun hunter ... I am a BOWhunter first and foremost and enjoy the challenge .. the challenge went out the window with crossbows ....
     
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2020

Share This Page