Laws are designed to be definitive and not by the interpretation of the officers. Even though these guys clearly were doing this for the attention they are well within the law walking down the street with these guns. I think what needs to be taken away from this is that our law makers are so focused on the end result and don't clearly think through all the possible scenerios before passing the laws. This most likely could have been avoided if the law was clear and this had been thought out ahead of time prior to it being passed.
Moot how? What was "not right"? They were fully within the scope of the law, apparently had zero intention of harming anyone so there is no comparison between that and "finding a way" to legally infringe their rights Team Red Sun Rising
Well we need to determine what constitutes as Disorderly Conduct... Guys walking down crowded public streets with Loaded AR-15s. I don't know, that's for the officers to decide.... It's definitely going to disrupt the public, though I agree they were well within their rights, and there was nothing to charge them with... but investigate... I'm fine with that, they could have stopped a mass killing by "Finding a way" . They took them downtown, questioned them and sent them home. I'm comfortable with that.
When officers draw their weapons on a suspect, there needs to be a clear danger. Two young men legally open carrying their weapons in public does not constitute a clear danger. I firmly believe the offices need to question people who do this, they need to make it very clear to them that nothing good can come of them trying to make this kind of statement, but this must be done without the use of force if there is no immediate danger. I would also say that the offices need to follow or keep close contact with these type of people while they are in a public forum.
What possable statement could they be making besides letting everyone know they are eat up with dumb ***. How many people in the market did not know it was legal to do it, felt uneasy about them doing it and now would like to see the law changed. I don't care if it's legal, I don't care if their intensions were good, it's stright up dumb **** with no benefits.
Let me first say this is MY opinion. Your opinion may differ, but that doesn't mean either of us are wrong, just that we disagree. Having said that, I completely disagree with what these guys did. In THIS case, I think police handled this appropriately. Here's why. I understand that open carry is legal in their area, and that they were making a statement within their 1st and 2nd amendments. However, the unfortunate fact is that many people ARE afraid of black rifles, and many of those people will immediately associate AR's with Newtown and similar events. It's not unreasonable to assume someone is going to call the police. They did obviously create a public disturbance, so disorderly conduct and disturbing the peace charges aren't unrealistic, nor should they be unexpected. As for the police response, they rolled up on two guys carrying rifles. People don't usually carry rifles for self defense, so I'm not surprised the police didn't automatically make that assumption. The police have as much right to self defense as anyone else, and if I had to confront two armed men without knowing their intentions, I wouldn't take chances either. From a gun rights standpoint, I think we need to exercise a little more critical thinking. Incidents like this really only result in negative publicity and bad press. I really don't understand why we keep pulling these unnecessarily provocative stunts? I don't think they're helping the cause. It's just adding fuel to the ban fire. Sent from my HTCEVOV4G using Tapatalk 2
I think what those two guys did was stupid, openly carrying AR-15s does nothing for anyone's cause except maybe they were "exercising their freedoms". There is a difference between being reasonable and just stupid and immature. There are laws, but there are acceptable societal norms that we follow to not cause a disturbance. These guys were causing a disturbance, imagine the outrage of the opposite situation. These guys openly carry, officers question, nothing happens. Officers walk away. These same two people open fire into the crowd, guess who gets in trouble. Its a no win situation for the cops except in rolling the dice.
Lets turn around your logic a little here. Remember don't ask don't tell. Gay people were not allowed to be openly gay in the military even though it was perfectly legal for them to be gay. This is the same type of thing. Should we all be closet gun owners, or should we be proud of being a gun owner and help educate the rest of the country that not all gun owners are going to shoot up a schoolyard?
The guys were trying to spark something. No Person wakes up, Gets dressed, grabs phone and wallet...........and AR and then heads out the door to start the day lol. A lot of people have been doing this just some in better safer places. a lot of people at a Farmers Market and possibly some farmers who don't play around. Just my thoughts
I feel that these 2 were completely within their legal rights. If nothing was posted at the farmers market about firearms not being allowed on the property then they police had no right to do what they did and should be sued for harassment.
Skywalker, I can see your point, but openly carrying ARs does nothing to further the cause of gun ownership. It only causes fear, just because you can win battles by beating people up and thinking that you can rule the people doesn't mean that you've won the war. Got to play tactically and the right moves, not just run in all out toting guns saying we are proud. Did African Americans and Blacks win the war (or presumably still ongoing) against racism by killing all the white people? No they used civil disobedience, they turned the tables using the media, they got people into power. It's about winning the right battles to win the war.
Just because you are scared of something doesn't make it wrong. I have two young boys, one is in 3rd grade. While I don't agree with strutting around the streets with a rifle strapped to you, I'm not going to condemn them either. If most people knew I carried a gun with me (including right now at work) they would probably judge me. I'm not looking for attention or trying to prove a point. I carry my gun for protection. Against who? Maybe two guys carrying AR15's to the farmers market. Maybe the kid who tries to rob the Kum&Go later this after noon. Who knows. They can carry whatever gun they want within the law for their personal protection. I wish there were no such thing as gun free zones also. You think my sons school is safer because it's a gun free zone? you think the pissed off parent or kid wanting to shoot up the place will stop and think about that? Nope. What it will do is place a couple hundred people in an auditorium that are completely defenseless. So carry on my fellow gun owners. Carry on.
The problem is not the guns, it's the fear of guns. The media and liberal society has brainwashed people to believe that guns are bad and everyone that has guns are crazy and dangerous. The battle we are fighting is ignorance. I'm not saying what they did is right or even smart, because I'm sure they didn't have pure intentions, but they were exercising their rights. No differently than Rosa Parks who refused to go to the back of the buss. I see what they were doing as civil disobedience, which is not against the law, and should not be treated as such. The police were certainly within their right, and duty to approach and question these individuals, but to draw their guns and detain them for doing something legal is outside of their rights.
LOL All of you guys defending these clowns, but believed the cop in the DWI checkpoint video was right. Please. These guys are 100x the tools of the kid in the DWI video. Let's have a black guy dressed in "urban" clothing walk down your street at night with an AR-15 strapped to his chest and see how many of you freak out and call the cops.
If you look back at the posts. There are very few if anyone who is Defending the guys in the video. What we are doing is defending the right to bear arms. Most gun owners would agree that what they did seems pointless and stupid. However, the truth remains that they were not breaking the law. I would call the police on a white guy carrying a rifle because I would wan them the check it out so lets not turn this into a race thing. We all know race discrimination exists and it's something that I hope changes for the better with ever new generation.
So it is not ok for cops to have "bent" the law for the safety of the people but it is ok for cops to do it when you agree with the purpose. It's true is it not? Im not talking about specifically you, as it is basically everyone. Think about it, we want to put away/kill bad guys when we know they've done something wrong, but it can't be proven in the court of law. We all know casey anthony killed her kid, we all know OJ is guilty, we all know that manning and snowden is traitor. But it would be more appropriate to bend the laws in those cases. There is a fine line that we cross daily, im not totally condoning the officers actions, but im not condemning them either. I would say "it was for the publics safety and that we should err on the side of caution/safety" but then again look where we are today. Also think about a different outcome, police apprehended, they showed no threat, they shot up the crowd. Guess who is on the hook? The police.
I'm not for the government bending or breaking their own rules at all. Americans citizen lose when that happens. If the system is broken, then it needs to be fixed, not bent or broken. Change the context, what if the police had drawn their guns and detained these men while they were walking to the shooting range? How would we all feel? I'm really not trying to defend them, because what they did was not smart, but I'm defending their right to do it. If that makes sense.
