Not a fan but luckily I live in a state that allows crossbows in the archery season for elderly and handicapped.
I have had two back surgeries and now surgery on both biceps, but I will shoot a "vertical bow" as long as I can. I find crossbows awkward and not fun to shoot. I honestly prefer shooting guns more than crossbows, but to each their own.
Don't like em either but elderly n disabled should be allowed. The article info is somewhat misleading from what I read. 40 yards isn't effective range considering the "jump the string" capabilities. If the deer were on high alert they'd def move enough to move you point of impact. I think it was Chuck Adams neurosurgeon friend did a study n basically I think it was over 600 fps to not jump the string at anything over 18 yards.
I have been thinking about picking one up for my dad. He is 84, and I really get nervous about him running around in the sub-zero temps they so often get in northern MN during the rifle season. I think that he would really enjoy hunting white tails in October.
I don't feel any pressure from crossbow hunters. I continue right along during the general firearm season with my bow so what do I care if crossbow hunters join me from Day 1 bow season?.....I don't. Long live the hunt.
Im a bowhunter. I cant imagine quitting bowhunting and taking up another sport and using anything other than a bow and arrow. Isnt the writer of that story the head (or president) of the of crossbow federation. He is the guy at the heart of all the political movements in the states that push for legislation making those things legal. He is also the head guy of the (for profit) horizontal hunter magazine and web site. PUBLISHER Im surprised bowhunting.com would have anything to do with him as bowhunting.com is a bowhunting entity.
Bowhunting.com also feels that there's nothing wrong with crossbows being allowed during archery season. In addition, Dan Hendricks is not only a good friend and a great person, but a strong advocate for all forms of hunting and helping people enjoy the outdoors. I believe we've beat this topic to death over the years. There's a few good posts on the topic if you want to read them. http://forums.bowhunting.com/bowhun...-all-hunters-56809/?highlight=crossbow+debate http://forums.bowhunting.com/bowhunting-talk/great-crossbow-debate-33064/?highlight=crossbow+debate
Many of the arguments in this debate are the same ones that took place when the big shift from recurves to compounds took place, believe me, I'm old enough to remember. The arguments then against the compounds were not valid just as the arguments now against the crossbows are weak. As a matter of fact, the explosion of compound bows brought many more people into the hunting fraternity. With the overall decline in hunter numbers I am hoping the legalization of crossbows will have the same effect. Yes, there will be slob hunters with crossbows but there are also slob hunters carrying every kind of weapon. If it gets more people interested in hunting then I am for it. And yes I still use a compound but I am older and there may come a day when I have to use a crossbow. When that day comes I will fully embrace it and still consider myself an archer. Blessings.........Pastorjim
I was invited to participate as an ad hoc committee member with the Michigan DNR/NRC early in 2000 when the crossbow lines were getting blurry due to extensive lobbying by the crossbow makers. Well over a decade prior, the Michigan Bowhunter Association had worked with the DNR on setting up guidelines for crossbow use so that only the elderly and medically affirmed physically challenged would be able to carry them during archery season. Since that was the original thrust of their argument....that banning crossbows exclusively would descriminate against those who genuinely could not physically draw a "vertical bow"....MBH proactively set out to address that issue while maintaining a firm boundary for the able-bodied. Next came women and kids as the target group....as bows were suddenly made out to be designed only for men who could draw and shoot 70# draw weight....despite the fact that target and lighter draw hunting bows were readily available. The emphasis was upon "recruitment" as hunter numbers were supposedly declining and thus it was no longer prudent to expect men to carry the bulk of the hunting heritage as in the past. "We" needed to make sure everyone could immediately shoot and be accurate in order to meet the PC climate of our day.....which a crossbow offered over the time and effort associated with a regular bow. The very thing that many bowhunters prided themselves on.....the effort and diligence and perserverance of skill development with a hand held bow....was suddenly being used against us because it was "exclusive" to sub-groups of the general population. The FORCED decision of the ad hoc committee I sat upon (meaning we were given no choice to vote totally against crossbow inclusion) was to allow them into regular firearms season. Predictably to all, this only lasted a couple years before the lobby groups pointed out that crossbows offer no advantage during firearms season when a rifle, shotgun or even handgun was easier and typically more efficient. Since women, kids and the elderly were given nothing with this move because they already could use a superior weapon, this action was soon challenged. On a level playing field, a crossbow offered no advantage so they again shifted to archery season.....which was obviously their brass ring prize and agenda all along. Just a couple years later, the Michigan NRC came out with a plan to give crossbows a "trial" inclusion into archery season for 3 years with a promised full evaluation of the impact. Well just two years into the "trial", the NRC decided that things were fine and preempted the process by granting them full inclusion. That was nearly a decade ago and I have personally never seen a woman, youth or elderly person carrying a crossbow while bowhunting. Instead, I have seen a number of 20-40's aged males carrying them with the reasoning that it required far less time and effort investment to be accurate. Thus our core concerns have been realized.....that crossbow inclusion was not about recruiting elderly men, women and kids.....but about competing in the lucrative archery market as an equal partner.....but with the hook of being faster and easier......the McDonald's of archery. Now "archery" catalogs and magazines are chocked full of crossbows, scopes, cases, bolts. backstops and broadheads as the predictable shift continues. Thankfully many genuine archers have resisted the urge make things easier, but a number have obviously shifted to that path since the elderly, women and kids are not the ones keeping archery magazines and catalog companies in business. How many elderly, women and kids are contributors to this site.....or Archery Talk....or the Bowsite? That argument is old, stale and contrived.
You mention WI. WI did what no other state has done. It created a separate crossbow season and separate crossbow license and crossbow registration so as not to impact or be included with or confused with bowhunting. Currently (as part of a two year trial) the crossbow season ran concurrent with bowhunting but I expect that to change due to the results of the trial period showing just how much more effective crossbows have been. a few resolutions in the WI spring hearings asked that (because of how much more effective crossbowers are than bowhunters) that the crossbow season be shortened. That is why WI did the correct thing in keeping the two sports separate so as not to negatively impact bowhunting. Other states made the mistake of lumping crossbowing in with bowhunting, now if there is a change that has to be made in those states because of the impacts of crossbows, bowhunters would be negatively impacted. Thankfully WI avoided that problem by completely separating the two sports. Personally, I support folks taking up all kinds of hunting and if a person wants to become a crossbower, more power to them. I can't fathom quitting bowhunting to become a crossbower when bowhunting is there for the taking but to each their own and the way its structured in WI, the two diff activities are cleanly separated. WI proved what many insisted in that crossbows did not bring new hunters to the woods. It only shifted existing gun hunters and some bowhunters to crossbowing. The myth of "new hunters" was clearly debunked. Folks that may wonder why that separation was important would have to understand the WI firearm deer hunter and why gun deer hunters care deeply about all the deer killed prior to the gun deer season (which takes place after both the bowhunters and the crossbowers have had months to remove deer from the landscape) When the orignal story linked here was posted, it should have included the disclaimer who the author is and what he does and how he profits from the expansion of crossbows.
the crossbow advocates fought vigorously against the separation for the exact reasons the data now shows. They wanted the numbers buried in with bowhunting usage and harvest numbers. WI policy makers and bowhunting advocates were very smart. The people involved with the creation of the law beat back the NRA and the crossbow lobby that demanded crossbow data be lumped in with real bowhunters so that the effectiveness of the crossbow could be hidden away. Now, because WI has actual usage and harvest data based on weapons type, gun hunters can see the effects of the two diff weapons. The data shows that crossbowers (per license as compared to both bow and gun hunters) are more effective than both bow and gun deer hunters. The kill rate per hunter for crossbowers is higher than even gun deer hunters. The buck kill per licensed crossbower (something gun deer hunters really care about since crossbowers go before gun deer hunters) was very high and higher than not only bowhunters but also gun deer hunters because the crossbow is a super effective and easy to master weapon that was given 2 months to kills bucks before gun deer hunters. The data shows that bowhunters harvest stayed historically static but that total numbers of real bowhunters actual declined. This data would be lost if crossbowers would have been lumped in with bowhunters.
I’ll say it again lest anybody be confused. I support all weapons but I even more so support game management based on sound data and that has to come from knowledge of weapons type and season length. The more effective the weapon, the shorter the season need be (which is why the WI bowhunting season is 3 ½ months long and the gun season is 9 days. The crossbow season in WI ought to be somewhere in the middle of that span. Now that the two year trial is over , many are asking to shorten the crossbow season but not change the bowhunting season. The crossbow advocates are angry thinking that because the 2 trial crossbow seasons which ran concurrent with bowhunting that the crossbow season should continue that duration. Thanks to the usage and harvest data, the crossbow season can be shortened to be on par with the other weapons so that no one user group is allowed to have such a big impact on the herd. In August, the discussion of shortening the crossbowers season continues.
The lobby money is what bugs me, it feels like it is getting shoved down the throat. There should be no issue with separating to accurately assess especially if during a trial period the season runs the same as archery, objections to that indicate something is being manipulated.
I disagree but we shall see. Gun hunters are a big group and are unhappy with the herd and when they see one group with a super effective weapon getting 3 1/2 months to kill bucks and they get nine days, they are eager to speak out to their elected reps. I would say more but thats all I care to devuldge at the time.
That's the appeal of cross bow it's the prefect cross over has trigger and scope just like a gun no new shooting skills to learn. You put way to much faith in a system ran by political idiot's who only slightly care more about reelection than lobbyist paychecks Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
That may be the case and exactly what happens with initial crossbow inclusion but there is nothing to lobby for with adjusting the season due to the data gathered from the 2 year trial.
